[Koha-devel] ES6 usage in the staff client

Tue Aug 8 05:35:18 CEST 2017

I can’t attend dev meetings due to being in the wrong timezone, so I’ll just speak up here.

I’d say the circ rules editor is still used by quite a few of our IE using librarians. If the circ rules editor is broken for them, they’re going to notice. And that would mean either we don’t upgrade them to the version where it breaks, or we hack around the use of non-IE supported code. And I imagine we wouldn’t be the only people hacking the code to make it work in IE. 

If we do go with non-IE supported code, I think we’d want to have some way of falling back or degrading to a version that works. I’m 100% in favour of modernity, but I’m also 100% in favour of practicality for librarians. 

Looking at  <https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Circulation_Rules_Interface_and_Backend_Revamp_RFC#Frontend> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Circulation_Rules_Interface_and_Backend_Revamp_RFC#Frontend and none of the mockup image links are working…

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

From: Jesse [mailto:pianohacker at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 8 August 2017 7:09 AM
To: Christopher Davis <cgdavis at uintah.utah.gov>
Cc: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>; Koha Devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] ES6 usage in the staff client

Owen, to answer your question, I'm working on bug 15522 (https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=15522), the circ rules editor revamp. Hoping to get a very basic prototype out soon.

I've added this to the next dev meeting, but I do want to mention something; while I have no great love for IE, and would love to encourage its abandonment, the circ rules editor is going to be accessed by a small subset of the staff. It may be less of a pain point to introduce non-IE-compatible code here than, say, the checkout screen.

2017-08-07 8:05 GMT-06:00 Christopher Davis <cgdavis at uintah.utah.gov <mailto:cgdavis at uintah.utah.gov> >:

Interesting topic!

Christopher Davis

Systems & E-Services Librarian

Uintah County Library

 <mailto:cgdavis at uintah.utah.gov> cgdavis at uintah.utah.gov

(435) 789-0091 <tel:14357890091>  ext.261
uintahlibrary.org <http://uintahlibrary.org> 
basinlibraries.org <http://basinlibraries.org> 
facebook.com/uintahcountylibrary <http://facebook.com/uintahcountylibrary> 
instagram.com/uintahcountylibrary <http://instagram.com/uintahcountylibrary> 

  <https://drive.google.com/a/uintah.utah.gov/uc?id=0B3CXDpFsfriXUHpVNjFKZ25QckU&export=download> 

On Sun, Aug 6, 2017 at 5:54 PM, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

I agree with Michael. While great strides have been made to get people off of IE6 and IE7 and Windows XP, there are still a lot of professionals being forced by their IT departments to use older versions of Windows and older versions of Internet Explorer.

Over the years, I've upstreamed a number of IE fixes and in a sense been a de facto Koha IE maintainer, but it sounds like that might not be possible in this case. If we go too far away from what users - rather than developers - actually use... then I think we have a problem. I think we'd be forfeiting users and potential users of Koha to other systems or to out-dated versions of Koha.

Maybe this is a crossroads where developing multiple themes again might be a good idea. I don't love the idea, but that might be one way of having an up-to-date backend with a modern front-end and a legacy front-end for people who can't have a modern option. In that case, it would be all the more reason for keeping business logic in code rather than templates. But that's just one idea.

Then again... maybe completely breaking Koha's staff end for IE users would make professionals put more demands on their IT departments. Demands such that IT departments were forced to actually support Firefox or Chrome. I wouldn't hold my breath, but... you never know. I could see us bending over backwards locally to provide an option to IE users though. And off the top of my head that would probably mean staying on an older version of Koha or trying to create our own theme to work with an upgraded backend or to replace the staff client all together with a simplified cross-browser user interface.

David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595

-----Original Message-----
From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>  [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> ] On Behalf Of Michael Kuhn
Sent: Friday, 4 August 2017 10:04 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] ES6 usage in the staff client

Am 04.08.2017 um 13:48 schrieb Owen Leonard:
>>    * Use ES6 classes. This will work in Firefox 45+ (which includes
>> two ESR releases), Chrome 42+, Edge and Safari 9
>
> I'm leaning towards this option, but it would be nice to get some
> feedback from users (or from support companies who ask their users?)
> who might be required by their workplace to use IE.
>
> What are you working on?

In
https://koha-community.org/manual/17.05/html/00_intro.html#koha-recommendations
the documentation says: "When working in the Koha staff client it is strongly recommended that you use the Firefox browser. Koha’s staff client is not supported in Internet Explorer and has not yet been fully optimized for Google Chrome."

Personally I am working with Mozilla Firefox 54.0.

But a lot of Koha staff users still work on MS Internet Explorer and usually they are FORCED to do so by their IT departments. Probably many or even most library users are also using the MS Internet Explorer when accessing the OPAC, so I think this unloved webbrowser definitely has to be supported in one way or the other (if not both).

Best wishes: Michael
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