Sending email on behalf of customers
Hi! I run Koha for several customers, and a number of them have email enabled. The sender of these emails is set to be the email of the library in question, e.g. library@example.org. Now, the problem is that services like GMail and Hotmail are not accepting these emails, because they see them as non-legitimate, in the sense that they are sent from some random server somewhere on the internet, that is not in any way associated with example.org. And they are right, of course! I *am* sending email on behalf of libraries from some random server on the internet. So, the question is: how to get around this? I see two possibilities: 1. Work with the sysadmins of the organizations of each library and have them include my servers in their "published lists of trusted servers" (I am thinking of stuff like SPF, PTR, OpenDKIM etc - I have not gotten my head around all of the details.) This would entail talking to lots of different sysadmins (if there is one) at lots of different organizations = lots of work... 2. So I was thinking about a second optoin - paying my way out, through some service like the ones listed here: https://zapier.com/learn/email-marketing/best-transactional-email-sending-se... My thinking is that GMail and Hotmail would "think" like "hm, this email says it comes from example.org, but it originated from some random server. BUT it was sent through ServiceX, which you have to pay to use, so it is probably legit". But I have no idea if GMail and Hotmail works like that at all. Does anyone else have a clue about this? Or some other way to solve the problem? Best regards, Magnus Enger Libriotech
As a workaround: Use real library email address in ReplyToDefault and ReturnpathDefault. Use the real server domain in the From address like library@[yourserver] Should cover most cases. As a fallback, autoforward eventual replies at the From address to the library. (Now you are only "in offense" here..) -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org] Namens Magnus Enger Verzonden: maandag 13 februari 2017 11:36 Aan: koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org Onderwerp: [Koha-devel] Sending email on behalf of customers Hi! I run Koha for several customers, and a number of them have email enabled. The sender of these emails is set to be the email of the library in question, e.g. library@example.org. Now, the problem is that services like GMail and Hotmail are not accepting these emails, because they see them as non-legitimate, in the sense that they are sent from some random server somewhere on the internet, that is not in any way associated with example.org. And they are right, of course! I *am* sending email on behalf of libraries from some random server on the internet. So, the question is: how to get around this? I see two possibilities: 1. Work with the sysadmins of the organizations of each library and have them include my servers in their "published lists of trusted servers" (I am thinking of stuff like SPF, PTR, OpenDKIM etc - I have not gotten my head around all of the details.) This would entail talking to lots of different sysadmins (if there is one) at lots of different organizations = lots of work... 2. So I was thinking about a second optoin - paying my way out, through some service like the ones listed here: https://zapier.com/learn/email-marketing/best-transactional-email-sending-se... My thinking is that GMail and Hotmail would "think" like "hm, this email says it comes from example.org, but it originated from some random server. BUT it was sent through ServiceX, which you have to pay to use, so it is probably legit". But I have no idea if GMail and Hotmail works like that at all. Does anyone else have a clue about this? Or some other way to solve the problem? Best regards, Magnus Enger Libriotech _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Thanks Marcel! I'll definitely give this a try! On 13 February 2017 at 11:44, Marcel de Rooy <M.de.Rooy@rijksmuseum.nl> wrote:
As a workaround: Use real library email address in ReplyToDefault and ReturnpathDefault. Use the real server domain in the From address like library@[yourserver]
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no? Best regards, Magnus
Hi Magnus, We had this issue too and the way to solve it is that your customer's server must "announced" that your Koha server can send email it their behalf. There is usually 2 ways to do so (you must do both) *SPF - Sender Policy Framework* *DKIM - DomainKeys Identified Mail* Digital Ocean has a good guide on how to do this : https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-install-and-configur... If you need additional help, Charles, on our team, is the one to contact ;-) Eric On 2017-02-13 07:23, Magnus Enger wrote:
Thanks Marcel!
I'll definitely give this a try!
As a workaround: Use real library email address in ReplyToDefault and ReturnpathDefault. Use the real server domain in the From address like library@[yourserver] My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be
On 13 February 2017 at 11:44, Marcel de Rooy <M.de.Rooy@rijksmuseum.nl> wrote: library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Best regards, Magnus _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
It has nothing to do with SPF, DKIM and such gadget (though it may help). Google wants your mail host to have consistent reverse-dns records (ptr). Which means : host [your ip address] should gives such results : Using domain server: Name: 8.8.8.8 Address: 8.8.8.8#53 Aliases: [your ip address].in-addr.arpa domain name pointer [your mailhost fqdn] Google's mail servers are really quite a pain to mail to. Also beware if your mailhost has ipv6 enable, the reverse dns record should be consistent for ipv6 too. Le 13/02/2017 à 13:40, Marcel de Rooy a écrit :
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no? Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
Erratum : At least SPF is indeed needed so as to be able to send mail for a domain and being recognized as legitimate user. Otherwise mail is accepted by Gmail/Hotmail/etc but thrown to the Spam folder. Sorry for my mistake and good luck to you. Arthur Le 13 février 2017 16:50:30 UTC+01:00, SUZUKI Arthur <arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr> a écrit :
It has nothing to do with SPF, DKIM and such gadget (though it may help).
Google wants your mail host to have consistent reverse-dns records (ptr).
Which means :
host [your ip address]
should gives such results :
Using domain server: Name: 8.8.8.8 Address: 8.8.8.8#53 Aliases:
[your ip address].in-addr.arpa domain name pointer [your mailhost fqdn]
Google's mail servers are really quite a pain to mail to. Also beware if your mailhost has ipv6 enable, the reverse dns record should be consistent for ipv6 too.
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be
Le 13/02/2017 à 13:40, Marcel de Rooy a écrit : library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
I have a mail server specifically for sending email from Koha and other services I host, but I'm just one email domain. My point is that some of your customers may already have an email server / service you could use for sending email. On Mon, Feb 13, 2017 at 10:56 AM, SUZUKI Arthur <arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr
wrote:
Erratum : At least SPF is indeed needed so as to be able to send mail for a domain and being recognized as legitimate user. Otherwise mail is accepted by Gmail/Hotmail/etc but thrown to the Spam folder.
Sorry for my mistake and good luck to you. Arthur
Le 13 février 2017 16:50:30 UTC+01:00, SUZUKI Arthur < arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr> a écrit :
It has nothing to do with SPF, DKIM and such gadget (though it may help).
Google wants your mail host to have consistent reverse-dns records (ptr).
Which means :
host [your ip address]
should gives such results :
Using domain server: Name: 8.8.8.8 Address: 8.8.8.8#53 Aliases:
[your ip address].in-addr.arpa domain name pointer [your mailhost fqdn]
Google's mail servers are really quite a pain to mail to. Also beware if your mailhost has ipv6 enable, the reverse dns record should be consistent for ipv6 too.
Le 13/02/2017 à 13:40, Marcel de Rooy a écrit :
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no.
Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
------------------------------
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_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Michael Hafen Washington County School District Technology Department Systems Analyst
Hi We experienced the same problem, we fixed it using Amazon SES, is like a certificate e-mail, it is very easy to use.. Amazon just send a verify mail to the address from you're going to send mails, and once is verified it becomes a 'certified' mail and all the major firewall, gmail allow to delivery them. Obviosusly you have to configure your mta to send mails using Amazon SES and it also have a cost, but it is quite low If you need more detailed info, just send me a mail Kindest Regatds Hugo 2017-02-13 16:50 GMT+01:00 SUZUKI Arthur <arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr>:
It has nothing to do with SPF, DKIM and such gadget (though it may help).
Google wants your mail host to have consistent reverse-dns records (ptr).
Which means :
host [your ip address]
should gives such results :
Using domain server: Name: 8.8.8.8 Address: 8.8.8.8#53 Aliases:
[your ip address].in-addr.arpa domain name pointer [your mailhost fqdn]
Google's mail servers are really quite a pain to mail to. Also beware if your mailhost has ipv6 enable, the reverse dns record should be consistent for ipv6 too.
Le 13/02/2017 à 13:40, Marcel de Rooy a écrit :
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no.
Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Thanks for your input, folks! Much appreciated! I will be looking more closely at your answers in the near future. I'll summarize my findings here when I have worked out a solution. Best regards, Magnus Enger Libriotech On 14 February 2017 at 14:46, Hugo Agud <info@orex.es> wrote:
Hi
We experienced the same problem, we fixed it using Amazon SES, is like a certificate e-mail, it is very easy to use.. Amazon just send a verify mail to the address from you're going to send mails, and once is verified it becomes a 'certified' mail and all the major firewall, gmail allow to delivery them.
Obviosusly you have to configure your mta to send mails using Amazon SES and it also have a cost, but it is quite low
If you need more detailed info, just send me a mail
Kindest Regatds Hugo
2017-02-13 16:50 GMT+01:00 SUZUKI Arthur <arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr>:
It has nothing to do with SPF, DKIM and such gadget (though it may help).
Google wants your mail host to have consistent reverse-dns records (ptr).
Which means :
host [your ip address]
should gives such results :
Using domain server: Name: 8.8.8.8 Address: 8.8.8.8#53 Aliases:
[your ip address].in-addr.arpa domain name pointer [your mailhost fqdn]
Google's mail servers are really quite a pain to mail to. Also beware if your mailhost has ipv6 enable, the reverse dns record should be consistent for ipv6 too.
Le 13/02/2017 à 13:40, Marcel de Rooy a écrit :
My server is available at something like myserver.libriotech.no. Should KohaAdminEmailAddress (which is used for From by default) be library@myserver.libriotech.no or just library@libriotech.no?
Depends on your exact configuration. Both domains may go the same ip address. Also check your reverse dns. When I check via mxtoolbox.com I do not get a response on myserver.libriotech.no But I cannot smtp check libriotech.no either.
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
participants (6)
-
Eric Bégin -
Hugo Agud -
Magnus Enger -
Marcel de Rooy -
Michael Hafen -
SUZUKI Arthur