From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Thu Nov  1 05:19:25 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2018 15:19:25 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Documentation for KohaTable() javascript function
Message-ID: <00f401d4719a$1293ded0$37bb9c70$@prosentient.com.au>

Hi all,

 

Does anyone know where there is any documentation for using the KohaTable()
javascript function? I'm muddling through, but it would be great if there
was something in at least
https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

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From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Thu Nov  1 09:03:45 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2018 08:03:45 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Handling for items lost in transit
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8BOvAksUz-q+ApZRhtJF6jiWx1JBRYsgKq=PsGWP7Bywg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I'm seeking some thoughts regarding 'Bug 21732 - If an item is marked as
lost, any outstanding transfers should be cancelled
<https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21732>'.

Currently, there is no thought given to transfers when an item is marked as
lost, an as such you may have lost items in the transfers queue.  This bug
aims to solve this by triggering a cancellation of the transfer at the
point an item is marked as lost.

We have a few questions:

1) Should this be treated as an enhancement or a bug (If it's an
enhancement then we would enable/disable it's functionality based upon a
system preference. If it's a bug (as I advocate), then it would be always
enabled and no system preference would be added)
2) If the items is 'in transit' where should the items holding library be
set to when it is marked as lost (the from or to library).
3) If we consider this a bug, should we add handling for cleaning up the
transfers table at upgrade time for any lost items.

Many thanks for your help,

*Martin Renvoize*

<https://www.ptfs-europe.com>

Development Team Manager





*Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728

*Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636

*Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com

*Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384


www.ptfs-europe.com







Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30

The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
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From jonathan.druart at bugs.koha-community.org  Thu Nov  1 12:38:15 2018
From: jonathan.druart at bugs.koha-community.org (Jonathan Druart)
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2018 08:38:15 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Documentation for KohaTable() javascript function
In-Reply-To: <00f401d4719a$1293ded0$37bb9c70$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <00f401d4719a$1293ded0$37bb9c70$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAJzKNY4Fik6tHoUigc0B9J6i7HcK7c2vZ2ry1sYLozAuMK3TWg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi David,

What do you want to know exactly?

`git grep KohaTable` will return:
includes/columns_settings.inc:function KohaTable(id_selector,
dt_parameters, columns_settings, add_filters) {

The more complete example is in reports/itemslost.tt, it has the
columns_settings and the filters.

Basically it's a wrapper for DataTables.

Cheers,
Jonathan


On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 at 01:19 David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
>
>
> Does anyone know where there is any documentation for using the
> KohaTable() javascript function? I?m muddling through, but it would be
> great if there was something in at least
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899 <02%2092%2012%2008%2099>
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595 <02%2080%2005%2005%2095>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Fri Nov  2 00:12:36 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2018 10:12:36 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Documentation for KohaTable() javascript function
In-Reply-To: <CAJzKNY4Fik6tHoUigc0B9J6i7HcK7c2vZ2ry1sYLozAuMK3TWg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <00f401d4719a$1293ded0$37bb9c70$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CAJzKNY4Fik6tHoUigc0B9J6i7HcK7c2vZ2ry1sYLozAuMK3TWg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <01ae01d47238$60de3f60$229abe20$@prosentient.com.au>

Hi Jonathan,

 

I figured it all out in the end, but I had to dig through the code to do so, which seems suboptimal in terms of getting contributors to use it and to keep usage consistent. I also noticed the arguments for the function KohaTable in the intranet are slightly different to the function KohaTable in the OPAC. 

 

It was all good in the end, but I was wondering if there was some documentation somewhere that I just couldn?t find, which would?ve made finishing the work faster. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Jonathan Druart [mailto:jonathan.druart at bugs.koha-community.org] 
Sent: Thursday, 1 November 2018 10:38 PM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
Cc: Koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Documentation for KohaTable() javascript function

 

Hi David,

 

What do you want to know exactly?

 

`git grep KohaTable` will return:

includes/columns_settings.inc:function KohaTable(id_selector, dt_parameters, columns_settings, add_filters) {

 

The more complete example is in reports/itemslost.tt <http://itemslost.tt> , it has the columns_settings and the filters.

 

Basically it's a wrapper for DataTables.

 

Cheers,

Jonathan

 

 

On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 at 01:19 David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

Hi all,

 

Does anyone know where there is any documentation for using the KohaTable() javascript function? I?m muddling through, but it would be great if there was something in at least https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Coding_Guidelines. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899 <tel:02%2092%2012%2008%2099> 

Direct: 02 8005 0595 <tel:02%2080%2005%2005%2095> 

 

_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/

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From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Fri Nov  2 10:39:09 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2018 09:39:09 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Permission to remove /misc/cronjobs/staticfines.pl
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8A07CfHg17y=pJVGj4nLD7UkFAwT5vyv8PYdCLmZOD7Sg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Everyone,

In a quest to clean up an unused database field in the issuingrules table
(Bug 21753 - issuingrules.chargename is unused and should be removed) I
found a fines script which I've never seen before.  It looks like a good
candidate for removal after a quick query to the irc channels but I wanted
to open it here to check if anyone is indeed still using this particular
mode of calculating fines.

Many thanks,

*Martin Renvoize*

<https://www.ptfs-europe.com>

Development Team Manager





*Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728

*Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636

*Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com

*Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384


www.ptfs-europe.com







Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30

The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com
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From victor.grousset at biblibre.com  Mon Nov  5 15:28:04 2018
From: victor.grousset at biblibre.com (Victor Grousset)
Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2018 15:28:04 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Permission to remove /misc/cronjobs/staticfines.pl
In-Reply-To: <CAB7SL8A07CfHg17y=pJVGj4nLD7UkFAwT5vyv8PYdCLmZOD7Sg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB7SL8A07CfHg17y=pJVGj4nLD7UkFAwT5vyv8PYdCLmZOD7Sg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e65713d0-2680-7f06-f208-033c407ebf3c@biblibre.com>

Hi,

On 18-11-02 10:39, Renvoize, Martin wrote:
> In a quest to clean up an unused database field in the issuingrules 
> table (Bug 21753 - issuingrules.chargename is unused and should be 
> removed) I found a fines script which I've never seen before.? It looks 
> like a good candidate for removal after a quick query to the irc 
> channels but I wanted to open it here to check if anyone is indeed still 
> using this particular mode of calculating fines.

We know at least 6 Koha instances that use this script.

It's from bug 6858
https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6858

Cheers,

-- 
Victor Grousset, dev support/maintenance
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Libre/Open Source software and services for libraries

From Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de  Mon Nov  5 15:38:40 2018
From: Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de (Katrin Fischer)
Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2018 15:38:40 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Permission to remove /misc/cronjobs/staticfines.pl
In-Reply-To: <e65713d0-2680-7f06-f208-033c407ebf3c@biblibre.com>
References: <CAB7SL8A07CfHg17y=pJVGj4nLD7UkFAwT5vyv8PYdCLmZOD7Sg@mail.gmail.com>
	<e65713d0-2680-7f06-f208-033c407ebf3c@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <trinity-ec55345d-7e2d-4cdd-bcad-bccc1072d9a7-1541428720858@3c-app-webde-bap52>

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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Thu Nov  8 20:20:53 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2018 14:20:53 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Freeze/Notes draft
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3OHvLx+R5nFpUspZDr6PQD5ZzijMw7L4GZ-3LjFgf+gqA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,

I have hit a multitude of issues today with my VMs and testing and did not
realize I was traveling tomorrow when I first set dates for release.

I plan to extend the freeze through Monday so that things in the queue (and
things I commented today) have some time to get fixed.

I will test everything I can today to provide feedback and do the final
push on Monday.

Thank you for your patience.

-Nick

-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Thu Nov  8 20:24:21 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2018 16:24:21 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Freeze/Notes draft
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3OHvLx+R5nFpUspZDr6PQD5ZzijMw7L4GZ-3LjFgf+gqA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OHvLx+R5nFpUspZDr6PQD5ZzijMw7L4GZ-3LjFgf+gqA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=UPBf0e7ML8O_9AdTBiqMY454VcrQW2u+wJMnnP2uFuYw@mail.gmail.com>

Good luck with that VMs!

El jue., 8 nov. 2018 a las 16:21, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
escribi?:

> Hello all,
>
> I have hit a multitude of issues today with my VMs and testing and did not
> realize I was traveling tomorrow when I first set dates for release.
>
> I plan to extend the freeze through Monday so that things in the queue
> (and things I commented today) have some time to get fixed.
>
> I will test everything I can today to provide feedback and do the final
> push on Monday.
>
> Thank you for your patience.
>
> -Nick
>
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Thu Nov  8 23:47:34 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2018 17:47:34 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Freeze/Notes draft
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=UPBf0e7ML8O_9AdTBiqMY454VcrQW2u+wJMnnP2uFuYw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OHvLx+R5nFpUspZDr6PQD5ZzijMw7L4GZ-3LjFgf+gqA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CABZfb=UPBf0e7ML8O_9AdTBiqMY454VcrQW2u+wJMnnP2uFuYw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3N7N-XKg-PVH6og--odypBQRR-q5uN_zT6bZkBiVvqndw@mail.gmail.com>

Erk, Monday is a holiday for us. Tuesday :-)

On Thu, Nov 8, 2018 at 2:24 PM Tomas Cohen Arazi <tomascohen at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Good luck with that VMs!
>
> El jue., 8 nov. 2018 a las 16:21, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
> escribi?:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I have hit a multitude of issues today with my VMs and testing and did
>> not realize I was traveling tomorrow when I first set dates for release.
>>
>> I plan to extend the freeze through Monday so that things in the queue
>> (and things I commented today) have some time to get fixed.
>>
>> I will test everything I can today to provide feedback and do the final
>> push on Monday.
>>
>> Thank you for your patience.
>>
>> -Nick
>>
>> --
>> Nick Clemens
>> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
>> ByWater Solutions
>> IRC: kidclamp
>>
> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
>
>
> --
> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
> ? +54 9351 3513384 <+54%209%20351%20351-3384>
> GPG: B2F3C15F
>
-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From fridolin.somers at biblibre.com  Tue Nov 13 09:57:02 2018
From: fridolin.somers at biblibre.com (Fridolin SOMERS)
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 09:57:02 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Replacing koha-plack, koha-start-zebra,
 etc with systemd services?
In-Reply-To: <066401d46a75$1f7d99f0$5e78cdd0$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <066401d46a75$1f7d99f0$5e78cdd0$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <4646eaa8-c9bf-bdd5-d3a9-7fe30c65adbd@biblibre.com>

Hi,

Welcome to a new world of SystemD.

We run all services with it (on Ubuntu Xenial) : starman, zebra server, 
zebra indexing and SIP server. Its really easy. We have added some 
tricks in ExecStartPre and ExecPostStop.
Starman launcher uses a config file plack.cfg to allow workers tuning 
from koha home (awesome).

Nginx and Memcached packages uses system launchers.

Here are our files, dont hesitate to ask for more details.

In the future, we would like to replace crontab.

Play with : systemctl --no-legend --all list-units starman.service 
koha-*.service

Regards,

Le 23/10/2018 ? 04:07, David Cook a ?crit?:
> Hi all,
> 
>   
> 
> I'm about to start working on a systemd service for running Plack (for a
> non-package Koha install), and I was wondering if anyone else has thought
> about or is using systemd services for Plack, Zebra, etc.
> 
>   
> 
> Mason did a great job with a systemd service
> https://github.com/KohaAloha/koha-mysql-init/blob/master/koha-mysql-init.ser
> vice for getting around the autoincrement issue (fixed in MySQL 8.0
> https://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/8.0/en/innodb-auto-increment-handling.html
> and MariaDB 10.2.4 https://mariadb.com/kb/en/library/auto_increment/).
> 
>   
> 
> Anyway, once I've got something working, I'm happy to share it. Curious if
> anyone has any systemd unit files they'd like to share.
> 
>   
> 
> David Cook
> 
> Systems Librarian
> 
> Prosentient Systems
> 
> 72/330 Wattle St
> 
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
> 
> Australia
> 
>   
> 
> Office: 02 9212 0899
> 
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> 

-- 
Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer
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PERL5LIB=/home/koha/src
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STARMAN_MAXREQ=50
STARMAN_WORKERS=2

From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Tue Nov 13 13:32:47 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 07:32:47 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Candidate for 18.05 Maintainer
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3NGLBUM1ir7Ors=iRTZ8hadkM7dvYkGLRHw51u9t2v8qw@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all!

Last week during the Koha developers meeting we voted on roles for the
19.05 release. I will be continuing as the Release Manager, and we have
many hands helping along the way (
https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roles_for_19.05)

There is one role left unfilled: 18.05 Release Maintainer (old stable)

The release maintainers are responsible for watching the bugs queue from
the upcoming release and backporting bugs that affect the version they
watch, helping to make sure version in use are kept as stable as possible.

It is a good way to learn more about different areas of Koha, to practice
your rebasing skills, and to get more involved in the community.

There will be many people in the community around to help you out, and we
are always looking for new faces to take on these roles.

If you are interested please add your name to the wiki page above and we
will be voting tomorrow to accept candidates if we have one in place.

If you have any questions you can ask the list or message me here or in IRC.

Thanks!
-Nick

-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Tue Nov 13 22:46:27 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 16:46:27 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Freeze and release notes
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3MJiyi9HFay-8FYGMZ=CeryurrY+_eEswKmaFxgPqqEhw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

I went through the queue today and pushed what I could, I think we got a
few nice things in today :-)

There are some outstanding bugs still, please keep up the great work and
help us sort these before release, especially majors/criticals and of
course, blockers

The release notes are generated rolling now, so first, very rough, draft is
already generated:
https://gitlab.com/koha-community/koha-release-notes/blob/master/release_notes_18_06_00.md

There are two outstanding enhancements I am considering, 18983 and 20244
for ES - they shouldn't affect Zebra code so I think they are safe and will
help uskeep ES momentum

Thanks for all your hard work, and your patience. Let me know your feedback
and where I can help.

-Nick

-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Wed Nov 14 02:52:26 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 22:52:26 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Freeze and release notes
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3MJiyi9HFay-8FYGMZ=CeryurrY+_eEswKmaFxgPqqEhw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3MJiyi9HFay-8FYGMZ=CeryurrY+_eEswKmaFxgPqqEhw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=Vr0AzHtf+skyoStkFbmQ=M3afwaSd3O2gU5z6d9+7XuQ@mail.gmail.com>

Yay!


El mar., 13 nov. 2018 a las 18:46, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
escribi?:

> Hi All,
>
> I went through the queue today and pushed what I could, I think we got a
> few nice things in today :-)
>
> There are some outstanding bugs still, please keep up the great work and
> help us sort these before release, especially majors/criticals and of
> course, blockers
>
> The release notes are generated rolling now, so first, very rough, draft
> is already generated:
>
> https://gitlab.com/koha-community/koha-release-notes/blob/master/release_notes_18_06_00.md
>
> There are two outstanding enhancements I am considering, 18983 and 20244
> for ES - they shouldn't affect Zebra code so I think they are safe and will
> help uskeep ES momentum
>
> Thanks for all your hard work, and your patience. Let me know your
> feedback and where I can help.
>
> -Nick
>
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From kohanews at gmail.com  Wed Nov 14 02:54:57 2018
From: kohanews at gmail.com (kohanews)
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 17:54:57 -0800
Subject: [Koha-devel] Call for News: November 2018 Newsletter
Message-ID: <3bb4e792-44a5-4f83-66e7-d1ff108a779a@gmail.com>

I'm collecting news for the November newsletter. Send anything 
noteworthy to:

k o h a news AT gmail dot com

News criteria:
---------------------------

** For events **:
 ?? - Please include dates for past events. If I can't find dates I may 
not add it.
 ?? - Announcements for future events with dates T.B.A. are fine ...Eg., 
Kohacon
 ?? - For past events , **** one month back is the cut-off? ****.

* News items can be of any length.
* Images are fine
* Anything and everything Koha.
* Submit by the 26th of the month.

If you are working on an interesting project or development related to
Koha, please let me know and I'll include it in the development section.

Thank you!

-- 
Chad Roseburg
Editor, Koha Community Newsletter


From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Wed Nov 14 07:05:27 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 17:05:27 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Replacing koha-plack, koha-start-zebra,
	etc with systemd services?
In-Reply-To: <4646eaa8-c9bf-bdd5-d3a9-7fe30c65adbd@biblibre.com>
References: <066401d46a75$1f7d99f0$5e78cdd0$@prosentient.com.au>
	<4646eaa8-c9bf-bdd5-d3a9-7fe30c65adbd@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <068701d47be0$0a783d90$1f68b8b0$@prosentient.com.au>

Thanks, Frido! Looking forward to taking a look.

I'd love to replace the crontab some day too!

David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595

-----Original Message-----
From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
[mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Fridolin
SOMERS
Sent: Tuesday, 13 November 2018 7:57 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Replacing koha-plack, koha-start-zebra, etc with
systemd services?

Hi,

Welcome to a new world of SystemD.

We run all services with it (on Ubuntu Xenial) : starman, zebra server,
zebra indexing and SIP server. Its really easy. We have added some tricks in
ExecStartPre and ExecPostStop.
Starman launcher uses a config file plack.cfg to allow workers tuning from
koha home (awesome).

Nginx and Memcached packages uses system launchers.

Here are our files, dont hesitate to ask for more details.

In the future, we would like to replace crontab.

Play with : systemctl --no-legend --all list-units starman.service
koha-*.service

Regards,

Le 23/10/2018 ? 04:07, David Cook a ?crit?:
> Hi all,
> 
>   
> 
> I'm about to start working on a systemd service for running Plack (for 
> a non-package Koha install), and I was wondering if anyone else has 
> thought about or is using systemd services for Plack, Zebra, etc.
> 
>   
> 
> Mason did a great job with a systemd service 
> https://github.com/KohaAloha/koha-mysql-init/blob/master/koha-mysql-in
> it.ser vice for getting around the autoincrement issue (fixed in MySQL 
> 8.0 
> https://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/8.0/en/innodb-auto-increment-handling
> .html and MariaDB 10.2.4 
> https://mariadb.com/kb/en/library/auto_increment/).
> 
>   
> 
> Anyway, once I've got something working, I'm happy to share it. 
> Curious if anyone has any systemd unit files they'd like to share.
> 
>   
> 
> David Cook
> 
> Systems Librarian
> 
> Prosentient Systems
> 
> 72/330 Wattle St
> 
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
> 
> Australia
> 
>   
> 
> Office: 02 9212 0899
> 
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : 
> http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> 

-- 
Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer



From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Wed Nov 14 13:12:14 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 07:12:14 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Filtering inventory results by cn_sort vs. callnumber
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3O-B2jztxSQW5LzaJk_Fim=Ffbhuj9BHTK9nibsd5yQUA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello All!

I put together a bug a while back for switching the sorting on inventory
results filter from using 'callnumber' to the hidden/constructed column
'cn_sort'

i.e. When inventorying a section by callnumber you would enter the range
GT90 to GT100, Koha would then interpret this to (roughly) GT090 and GT100
as we do when constructing the cn_sort column.

'cn_sort' is the column we use to pad callnumbers with '0' and spaces to
ensure that a callnumber of GT90 is sorted before GT100 (if sorted as
normal strings 1 comes before 9)

During review if the bug there was concern that some callnumber schemes may
not work under this change, or some libraries might not have the cn_sort
columns correctly filled and that we should add a system preference to
control which column was used.

On bug 21629 (
https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21629) we made
sorting lists by callnumber use cn_sort by default.

I am just writing to see if any libraries out there have concerns about the
change, or if we think that always using cn_sort to filter the results
would work. We want to be consistent throughtout the code (ideally)

Let me know what thoughts you have and if you think we can simply assume
cn_sort is the definitive column for sorting and defining ranges.

-Nick


-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Wed Nov 14 14:47:59 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 14:47:59 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] removing some projects from git.koha-community.org
Message-ID: <e0be21fd-7ed8-3929-7863-ff9e5dc99c23@biblibre.com>

Hello,

on git.k-c.org, there are some project that have not been updated for 
years, and I'm wondering whether we should/could hide or delete them:

This question is for the following repos:

  * koha-translations.git ??? Translations files (.po) for...
    Translation Manager ??? 3 years ago
  * mm/jcamins.git ??? MM repo for authorities ??? Jared Camins-Esakov
     ??? 4 years ago
  * mm/chrisc.git ??? MM repo for testing ??? Chris Cormack ??? 4 years ago
  * wip/koha-equinox.git ??? Equinox work in progress ??? Galen Charlton
     ??? 5 years ago
  * koha-small.git ??? main Koha release repository ??? Koha Project ???
    6 years ago
  * wip/koha-catalyst.git ??? Catalyst work in progress ??? Chris
    Cormack ??? 6 years ago
  * wip/koha-chris_n.git ??? Personal work in progress ??? Chris
    Nighswonger ??? 7 years ago
  * wip/koha-biblibre.git ??? BibLibre work in progress Henri-Damien
    Laurent ??? 7 years ago
  * wip/koha-fbc.git ??? Foundations Bible College... ??? Chris
    Nighswonger ??? 7 years ago
  * wip/koha-ptfs.git ??? PTFS work in progress ??? J. David Bavousett
     ??? 8 years ago

the koha-biblibre.git, for sure, BibLibre don't use it at all, it can be 
discarded.

I haven't listed:

  * website.git ??? Koha website repository ??? Koha Project ??? 5 years
    ago
  * koha-archive.git???? Old Koha topic branches???? Koha Project???? 5
    years ago

but maybe they can be included as well.

good idea or not ?

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries

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From gmc at equinoxinitiative.org  Wed Nov 14 14:54:48 2018
From: gmc at equinoxinitiative.org (Galen Charlton)
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 08:54:48 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] removing some projects from git.koha-community.org
In-Reply-To: <e0be21fd-7ed8-3929-7863-ff9e5dc99c23@biblibre.com>
References: <e0be21fd-7ed8-3929-7863-ff9e5dc99c23@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <CAPLnt65mCN7X0pxsa1k-t9nkWLUra+S=dCnADNUMV6Vq1GrdLA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 8:48 AM Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
wrote:
> wip/koha-equinox.git     Equinox work in progress     Galen Charlton
5 years ago

This one is disused and from Equinox's point of view does not need to be
retained.

Regards,

Galen
--
Galen Charlton
Implementation and Services Manager
Equinox Open Library Initiative
phone:  1-877-OPEN-ILS (673-6457)
email:  gmc at equinoxInitiative.org
web:  https://equinoxInitiative.org
direct: +1 770-709-5581
cell:   +1 404-984-4366
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From chris.nighswonger at gmail.com  Wed Nov 14 15:03:21 2018
From: chris.nighswonger at gmail.com (Christopher Nighswonger)
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 09:03:21 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] removing some projects from git.koha-community.org
In-Reply-To: <CAPLnt65mCN7X0pxsa1k-t9nkWLUra+S=dCnADNUMV6Vq1GrdLA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e0be21fd-7ed8-3929-7863-ff9e5dc99c23@biblibre.com>
	<CAPLnt65mCN7X0pxsa1k-t9nkWLUra+S=dCnADNUMV6Vq1GrdLA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAA7=B8zSG6N__m6ZH4ueDVTStLbYwr4a+5ahG_ARigPYJSPhNQ@mail.gmail.com>

This one may be removed as well:

wip/koha-fbc.git     Foundations Bible College...     Chris Nighswonger
7 years ago

On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 8:55 AM Galen Charlton <gmc at equinoxinitiative.org>
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 8:48 AM Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
> wrote:
> > wip/koha-equinox.git     Equinox work in progress     Galen Charlton
> 5 years ago
>
> This one is disused and from Equinox's point of view does not need to be
> retained.
>
> Regards,
>
> Galen
> --
> Galen Charlton
> Implementation and Services Manager
> Equinox Open Library Initiative
> phone:  1-877-OPEN-ILS (673-6457)
> email:  gmc at equinoxInitiative.org
> web:  https://equinoxInitiative.org
> direct: +1 770-709-5581
> cell:   +1 404-984-4366
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From M.de.Rooy at rijksmuseum.nl  Thu Nov 15 08:42:07 2018
From: M.de.Rooy at rijksmuseum.nl (Marcel de Rooy)
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2018 07:42:07 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Signoff request
Message-ID: <AM6PR05MB59766F50BF718D7AC0351CF0CEDC0@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>

Hi all,

Please help getting bug 21774 into the next release by signing off. Marked as critical last week.
https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21774

Thanks,

Marcel

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From ephetteplace at cca.edu  Thu Nov 15 21:56:54 2018
From: ephetteplace at cca.edu (Eric Phetteplace)
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2018 12:56:54 -0800
Subject: [Koha-devel] [Koha] [EXTERNAL] Filtering inventory results by
	cn_sort vs. callnumber
In-Reply-To: <CADiPvhkNaxpKQE4jtWGPYbSy-v7hAOi3Emov2B9F_dQQxXjWtQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3O-B2jztxSQW5LzaJk_Fim=Ffbhuj9BHTK9nibsd5yQUA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CADiPvhkNaxpKQE4jtWGPYbSy-v7hAOi3Emov2B9F_dQQxXjWtQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACSkZcY6yDSzz3_F1mJbECXXgkO541PYmCTTj77-CJm83O1qLw@mail.gmail.com>

I'm in support of using cn_sort wherever sorting occurs as that's its
purpose. If I'm not mistaken, it's already being used in some places
without an existing system preference, and I don't see how the Inventory
tool is categorically different. Is it possible, perhaps in a plugin, to
configure new normalization methods for different classification sources?
That seems to be the purpose of the Classification Sources admin settings
but I'm not sure.

To answer Heather?I think your second question is correct, the two problems
are not intertwined. One deals with LC numbers being improperly normalized
and another deals with the normalized strings not being used as the sorting
value in places.

Best,

ERIC PHETTEPLACE

Systems Librarian


libraries.cca.edu | vault.cca.edu | 510.594.3660

5212 Broadway, Oakland, CA 94618

1111 8th St., San Francisco, CA 94107

Preferred Pronoun(s): he/him

:(){ :|: & };:


On Thu, Nov 15, 2018 at 8:01 AM Hernandez, Heather <
heather_hernandez at nps.gov> wrote:

> Hi, Nick--
>
> I read through Bug 21629 and if I'm reading it correctly, it says that call
> numbers are sorted correctly using cn_sort, but Bug 17269 describes how
> call numbers are not sorted correctly using cn_sort, specifically the ones
> with colons in them in the G Library of Congress classification schedule.
>
> Has Bug 21629 been tested using LC call numbers with colons in them?  Or is
> the problem of incorrect sorts of LC call numbers with colons in them
> unrelated?
>
> Thank you!  Cheers,
> h2
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Heather Hernandez
> Technical Services Librarian
> San Francisco Maritime National Historical Park Research Center
> 2 Marina Blvd., Bldg. E, 3rd floor, San Francisco, CA  94123-1284
> 415-561-7032, heather_hernandez at nps.gov
> Library catalog: http://keys.bywatersolutions.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Koha mailing list  http://koha-community.org
> Koha at lists.katipo.co.nz
> https://lists.katipo.co.nz/mailman/listinfo/koha
>
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Fri Nov 16 05:58:00 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2018 15:58:00 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
	failure email the next day
Message-ID: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>

Hi all,

 

I've found a case where autorenewals will renew an item one day (e.g.
Monday) and the next day (e.g. Tuesday) it will say that a hold has been
found and that it can't renew the item. (Someone must've put a hold on the
item between the two cronjob runs.)

 

It seems to me this is a bug in how C4::Circulation::CanBookBeRenewed is
written. 

 

The first check it makes is for holds and if it finds a hold it returns an
error. 

 

However, if you're using autorenewals, you should first check to see if it's
too early to even bother renewing. 

 

I'm just emailing here to see if anyone else is having this issue, or if
anyone knows if there is already a Bugzilla issue open for it. It seems like
there are a lot of autorenewal Bugzilla issues but I couldn't find anything.
Figure asking first lessens the need for someone to mark one as a duplicate
later.

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

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From fridolin.somers at biblibre.com  Fri Nov 16 13:45:15 2018
From: fridolin.somers at biblibre.com (Fridolin SOMERS)
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2018 13:45:15 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha plugins Apache Alias
Message-ID: <23f979ef-6dee-31fa-ce8b-533b13e0c042@biblibre.com>

Hi,

For Koha plugins, there is in etc/koha-httpd.conf :
    Alias /plugin/ "__PLUGINS_DIR__/"

I dont see this in debian/templates o_O

Since we allow plugin to add load of JS/CSS files for intranet and OPAC, 
should be add this alias for both ?

Looks like this is needed for actual EDS plugin.
https://github.com/ebsco/edsapi-koha-plugin/

Best regards,

-- 
Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer

From tomascohen at gmail.com  Fri Nov 16 14:09:35 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2018 10:09:35 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha plugins Apache Alias
In-Reply-To: <23f979ef-6dee-31fa-ce8b-533b13e0c042@biblibre.com>
References: <23f979ef-6dee-31fa-ce8b-533b13e0c042@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=XBLsF8+uWRw4b=O-Nk-+YCgxHuB=kupp8P6VFrkyxvuw@mail.gmail.com>

It is used 8for example) for serving static content like images.

With bug 21116, we might replace it with something more fine grained.

El vie., 16 nov. 2018 a las 9:45, Fridolin SOMERS (<
fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>) escribi?:

> Hi,
>
> For Koha plugins, there is in etc/koha-httpd.conf :
>     Alias /plugin/ "__PLUGINS_DIR__/"
>
> I dont see this in debian/templates o_O
>
> Since we allow plugin to add load of JS/CSS files for intranet and OPAC,
> should be add this alias for both ?
>
> Looks like this is needed for actual EDS plugin.
> https://github.com/ebsco/edsapi-koha-plugin/
>
> Best regards,
>
> --
> Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
> BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>


-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From fridolin.somers at biblibre.com  Fri Nov 16 16:12:36 2018
From: fridolin.somers at biblibre.com (Fridolin SOMERS)
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2018 16:12:36 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha plugins Apache Alias
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=XBLsF8+uWRw4b=O-Nk-+YCgxHuB=kupp8P6VFrkyxvuw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <23f979ef-6dee-31fa-ce8b-533b13e0c042@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=XBLsF8+uWRw4b=O-Nk-+YCgxHuB=kupp8P6VFrkyxvuw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6fcbd0d2-8b50-c36b-4f60-89e4370db696@biblibre.com>

Serving a statis JS or CSS file via a REST API call ?
Isn't it strange ?

Le 16/11/2018 ? 14:09, Tomas Cohen Arazi a ?crit?:
> It is used 8for example) for serving static content like images.
> 
> With bug 21116, we might replace it with something more fine grained.
> 
> El vie., 16 nov. 2018 a las 9:45, Fridolin SOMERS (<
> fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>) escribi?:
> 
>> Hi,
>>
>> For Koha plugins, there is in etc/koha-httpd.conf :
>>      Alias /plugin/ "__PLUGINS_DIR__/"
>>
>> I dont see this in debian/templates o_O
>>
>> Since we allow plugin to add load of JS/CSS files for intranet and OPAC,
>> should be add this alias for both ?
>>
>> Looks like this is needed for actual EDS plugin.
>> https://github.com/ebsco/edsapi-koha-plugin/
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> --
>> Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
>> BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>>
> 
> 

-- 
Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer

From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Fri Nov 16 21:31:36 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2018 20:31:36 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Permission to remove /misc/cronjobs/staticfines.pl
In-Reply-To: <trinity-ec55345d-7e2d-4cdd-bcad-bccc1072d9a7-1541428720858@3c-app-webde-bap52>
References: <CAB7SL8A07CfHg17y=pJVGj4nLD7UkFAwT5vyv8PYdCLmZOD7Sg@mail.gmail.com>
	<e65713d0-2680-7f06-f208-033c407ebf3c@biblibre.com>
	<trinity-ec55345d-7e2d-4cdd-bcad-bccc1072d9a7-1541428720858@3c-app-webde-bap52>
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8AC+-Zj=h-9vsTTgYHL9sZE9d+8_jJ_tTmbA-v_jFnx1A@mail.gmail.com>

Glad I asked, and good to know it is still useful for some out there.

 Agree with Katrin though, it would be great to have it documented so
others may use it too and not duplicate effort if they have similar needs.

>From a developers point of view, I struggled to understand its use and as
such when looking at bugs in that area of the codebase I wasn't entirely
confident I wouldn't be introducing bugs into this script inadvertently
whilst fixing code it utilises.



On Mon, 5 Nov 2018, 2:38 pm Katrin Fischer <Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de wrote:

> Hi,
>
> the documentation is not clear about fines.pl being the standard and
> staticfines being a different use case. We should at least update the
> manual:
>
>
> https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/cron_jobs.html#cron-jobs-subchapter-label
>
> For example: where do you configure the fine amount, intervals, etc.
>
> Katrin
>
> *Gesendet:* Montag, 05. November 2018 um 15:28 Uhr
> *Von:* "Victor Grousset" <victor.grousset at biblibre.com>
> *An:* "Renvoize, Martin" <martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com>,
> koha at lists.katipo.co.nz, "Koha Devel" <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> >
> *Betreff:* Re: [Koha-devel] Permission to remove /misc/cronjobs/
> staticfines.pl
> Hi,
>
> On 18-11-02 10:39, Renvoize, Martin wrote:
> > In a quest to clean up an unused database field in the issuingrules
> > table (Bug 21753 - issuingrules.chargename is unused and should be
> > removed) I found a fines script which I've never seen before.  It looks
> > like a good candidate for removal after a quick query to the irc
> > channels but I wanted to open it here to check if anyone is indeed still
> > using this particular mode of calculating fines.
>
> We know at least 6 Koha instances that use this script.
>
> It's from bug 6858
> https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6858
>
> Cheers,
>
> --
> Victor Grousset, dev support/maintenance
> BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
> BibLibre, Libre/Open Source software and services for libraries
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
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From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Sat Nov 17 20:40:43 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2018 14:40:43 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>

Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There should be a
one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem records ...
so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for biblioitems?

--Barton
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Sat Nov 17 21:24:27 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2018 17:24:27 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=UMYkygHBm+G=O5YkiUpnX+2R5Lvcz460_kif++N4oQRA@mail.gmail.com>

Or merge biblio and biblioitems ;-)

El s?b., 17 nov. 2018 a las 16:41, Barton Chittenden (<
barton at bywatersolutions.com>) escribi?:

> Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There should be a
> one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem records ...
> so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for biblioitems?
>
> --Barton
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Mon Nov 19 02:23:44 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2018 20:23:44 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>

Koha doesn't currently have a single point of truth for documentation of
notices and slips, which has lead to a proliferation of markup syntaxes,
especially in regard to repeating detail, e.g.

DUEDGST/PREDUEDGST:

   <<items.content>>

ODUE*

   <<items.content>>
   or <item> </item>

CHECKOUT/CHECKIN/RENEWAL

   ----
   Detail here
   ----

These have been documented in
https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Customising_Notices_and_Slips#Notice_Markup
, but this has gotten out of date as new notices get added in each version
of Koha.

Work to be done:

Add Koha/Notices.pod which will document the following for each notice in
the Letter table:

* Letter Code
* Source file where the notice is populated
* Logic that triggers the notice
* Detail syntax (if any)
* Available data (tables and substitutions)
* Message transport restrictions

The output from this pod should be used as the basis for the Koha user
documentation.

See  Bug 21858  and
https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Notice_documentation_rfc
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From sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 19 09:44:03 2018
From: sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com (Sophie Meynieux)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 09:44:03 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>

Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha 
documentation 
(https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips) 
but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05

Regards

S. Meynieux

-- 
Responsable support
BibLibre
+ 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
http://www.biblibre.com

Le 19/11/2018 ? 02:23, Barton Chittenden a ?crit?:
> Koha doesn't currently have a single point of truth for documentation 
> of notices and slips, which has lead to a proliferation of markup 
> syntaxes, especially in regard to repeating detail, e.g.
>
> DUEDGST/PREDUEDGST:
>
> ? ?<<items.content>>
>
> ODUE*
>
> ? ?<<items.content>>
> ? ?or <item> </item>
>
> CHECKOUT/CHECKIN/RENEWAL
> ? ?----
> ? ?Detail here
> ? ?----
>
> These have been documented in 
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Customising_Notices_and_Slips#Notice_Markup 
> , but this has gotten out of date as new notices get added in each 
> version of Koha.
>
> Work to be done:
>
> Add Koha/Notices.pod which will document the following for each notice 
> in the Letter table:
>
> * Letter Code
> * Source file where the notice is populated
> * Logic that triggers the notice
> * Detail syntax (if any)
> * Available data (tables and substitutions)
> * Message transport restrictions
>
> The output from this pod should be used as the basis for the Koha user 
> documentation.
>
> See Bug 21858 and 
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Notice_documentation_rfc
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 19 09:44:55 2018
From: sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com (Sophie Meynieux)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 09:44:55 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=UMYkygHBm+G=O5YkiUpnX+2R5Lvcz460_kif++N4oQRA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CABZfb=UMYkygHBm+G=O5YkiUpnX+2R5Lvcz460_kif++N4oQRA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <12a0ca0e-b8d3-ccea-8b84-500a4d8d78cf@biblibre.com>

+1

S. Meynieux

-- 
Responsable support
BibLibre
+ 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
http://www.biblibre.com

Le 17/11/2018 ? 21:24, Tomas Cohen Arazi a ?crit?:
> Or merge biblio and biblioitems ;-)
>
> El s?b., 17 nov. 2018 a las 16:41, Barton Chittenden 
> (<barton at bywatersolutions.com <mailto:barton at bywatersolutions.com>>) 
> escribi?:
>
>     Just out?of curiosity, why does?biblioitemnumber exist? There
>     should be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and
>     biblioitem records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary
>     key for biblioitems?
>
>     --Barton
>     _______________________________________________
>     Koha-devel mailing list
>     Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>     <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>     http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>     website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>     git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>     bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
>
>
> -- 
> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io <http://theke.io/>)
> ? +54 9351 3513384
> GPG: B2F3C15F
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 19 10:02:17 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 10:02:17 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>

<wise-old-man mode ON>

Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR compliant 
software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not 
innovative :D )

More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio 
description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more expression 
of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN 
the different items. Very efficient and handy.

When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management (MARC 
has only 2 levels, biblio and items).

In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc" cataloguing. 
It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing 
remained.

At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been merged, 
but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we want 
to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )

<wise-old-man mode OFF>


Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit?:
> Just out?of curiosity, why does?biblioitemnumber exist? There should 
> be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem 
> records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for 
> biblioitems?
>
> --Barton

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries


From tomascohen at gmail.com  Mon Nov 19 14:02:24 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 10:02:24 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>

Great info, Paul!

We now removed the marc/marcxml columns from biblioitems too, so it makes
more sense to merge them.

El lun., 19 nov. 2018 a las 6:02, Paul Poulain (<paul.poulain at biblibre.com>)
escribi?:

> <wise-old-man mode ON>
>
> Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR compliant
> software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not
> innovative :D )
>
> More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio
> description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more expression
> of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN
> the different items. Very efficient and handy.
>
> When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management (MARC
> has only 2 levels, biblio and items).
>
> In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc" cataloguing.
> It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing
> remained.
>
> At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been merged,
> but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we want
> to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )
>
> <wise-old-man mode OFF>
>
>
> Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit :
> > Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There should
> > be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem
> > records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for
> > biblioitems?
> >
> > --Barton
>
> --
> Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
> BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
> BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From M.de.Rooy at rijksmuseum.nl  Mon Nov 19 14:08:20 2018
From: M.de.Rooy at rijksmuseum.nl (Marcel de Rooy)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 13:08:20 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>

Three levels in BIBFrame again ?

Van: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> Namens Tomas Cohen Arazi
Verzonden: maandag 19 november 2018 14:02
Aan: Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
CC: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Onderwerp: Re: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?

Great info, Paul!

We now removed the marc/marcxml columns from biblioitems too, so it makes more sense to merge them.

El lun., 19 nov. 2018 a las 6:02, Paul Poulain (<paul.poulain at biblibre.com<mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>) escribi?:
<wise-old-man mode ON>

Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR compliant
software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not
innovative :D )

More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio
description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more expression
of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN
the different items. Very efficient and handy.

When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management (MARC
has only 2 levels, biblio and items).

In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc" cataloguing.
It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing
remained.

At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been merged,
but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we want
to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )

<wise-old-man mode OFF>


Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit :
> Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There should
> be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem
> records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for
> biblioitems?
>
> --Barton

--
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries

_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org<mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/


--
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io<http://theke.io/>)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From ere.maijala at helsinki.fi  Mon Nov 19 14:39:08 2018
From: ere.maijala at helsinki.fi (Ere Maijala)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 15:39:08 +0200
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>

If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er) 
slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately.

--Ere

Marcel de Rooy kirjoitti 19.11.2018 klo 15.08:
> Three levels in BIBFrame again ?
> 
> *Van:* koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org 
> <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> *Namens *Tomas Cohen Arazi
> *Verzonden:* maandag 19 november 2018 14:02
> *Aan:* Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
> *CC:* koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Onderwerp:* Re: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
> 
> Great info, Paul!
> 
> We now removed the marc/marcxml columns from biblioitems too, so it 
> makes more sense to merge them.
> 
> El lun., 19 nov. 2018 a las 6:02, Paul Poulain 
> (<paul.poulain at biblibre.com <mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>) escribi?:
> 
>     <wise-old-man mode ON>
> 
>     Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR compliant
>     software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not
>     innovative :D )
> 
>     More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio
>     description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more expression
>     of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN
>     the different items. Very efficient and handy.
> 
>     When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management
>     (MARC
>     has only 2 levels, biblio and items).
> 
>     In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc" cataloguing.
>     It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing
>     remained.
> 
>     At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been merged,
>     but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we want
>     to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )
> 
>     <wise-old-man mode OFF>
> 
> 
>     Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit?:
>      > Just out?of curiosity, why does?biblioitemnumber exist? There should
>      > be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem
>      > records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for
>      > biblioitems?
>      >
>      > --Barton
> 
>     -- 
>     Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
>     BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
>     BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     Koha-devel mailing list
>     Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>     <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>     http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>     website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>     git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>     bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
> 
> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io <http://theke.io/>)
> ?+54 9351 3513384
> GPG: B2F3C15F
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> 

-- 
Ere Maijala
Kansalliskirjasto / The National Library of Finland

From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 19 14:41:18 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 14:41:18 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
Message-ID: <0e4e9067-ff85-6ccb-1f25-7cd6c35bea80@biblibre.com>

 From my side it was a joke: we will integrate the new standards, no 
doubts, but we'll do it more cleanly than using biblio/biblioitems/items !

Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:39, Ere Maijala a ?crit?:
> If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er) 
> slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately. 

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries


From mik at adminkuhn.ch  Mon Nov 19 14:44:40 2018
From: mik at adminkuhn.ch (Michael Kuhn)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 14:44:40 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>

Hi Sophie

 > Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha
 > documentation
 > 
(https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips) 

 > but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05

For Koha 18.05 you can find the field guide at

https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips

Best wishes: Michael
-- 
Gesch?ftsf?hrer ? Diplombibliothekar BBS, Informatiker eidg. Fachausweis
Admin Kuhn GmbH ? Pappelstrasse 20 ? 4123 Allschwil ? Schweiz
T 0041 (0)61 261 55 61 ? E mik at adminkuhn.ch ? W www.adminkuhn.ch

From ere.maijala at helsinki.fi  Mon Nov 19 14:51:41 2018
From: ere.maijala at helsinki.fi (Ere Maijala)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 15:51:41 +0200
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <0e4e9067-ff85-6ccb-1f25-7cd6c35bea80@biblibre.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<0e4e9067-ff85-6ccb-1f25-7cd6c35bea80@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <f2727f35-8bd1-c5ee-9d9e-38d0f5bdda50@helsinki.fi>

Phew! :)

Paul Poulain kirjoitti 19.11.2018 klo 15.41:
>  From my side it was a joke: we will integrate the new standards, no 
> doubts, but we'll do it more cleanly than using biblio/biblioitems/items !
> 
> Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:39, Ere Maijala a ?crit?:
>> If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er) 
>> slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately. 
> 

-- 
Ere Maijala
Kansalliskirjasto / The National Library of Finland

From sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 19 14:54:38 2018
From: sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com (Sophie Meynieux)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 14:54:38 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
	<e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
Message-ID: <74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>

Thanks,
It's ok with the url but you can't find it (or I can't find it) directly 
on 18.05 documentation page

Sophie

-- 
Responsable support
BibLibre
+ 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
http://www.biblibre.com

Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:44, Michael Kuhn a ?crit?:
> Hi Sophie
>
> > Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha
> > documentation
> > 
> (https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips) 
>
> > but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05
>
> For Koha 18.05 you can find the field guide at
>
> https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips 
>
>
> Best wishes: Michael

From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Mon Nov 19 16:15:10 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 10:15:10 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
	<e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
	<74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVtB4KrPAEQ3Q=PA_Smj_Niv8_pHcqDZukEt2VmTB_T1EQ@mail.gmail.com>

The field guide is based on the wiki page, which I maintained... but I
think that developers should be documenting any notices they add, which is
why I've added this to the agenda for Wednesday's dev meeting:

*Review of coding guidelines*

   - Proposed coding guideline DOC2: Entries in the *letter* table must be
   documented in *Koha/Notices.pod*. See Bug 21858 - RFC: Notices and slips
   documentation
   <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21858>


On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 8:55 AM Sophie Meynieux <
sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com> wrote:

> Thanks,
> It's ok with the url but you can't find it (or I can't find it) directly
> on 18.05 documentation page
>
> Sophie
>
> --
> Responsable support
> BibLibre
> + 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
> http://www.biblibre.com
>
> Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:44, Michael Kuhn a ?crit :
> > Hi Sophie
> >
> > > Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha
> > > documentation
> > >
> > (
> https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips)
>
> >
> > > but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05
> >
> > For Koha 18.05 you can find the field guide at
> >
> >
> https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips
> >
> >
> > Best wishes: Michael
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de  Mon Nov 19 16:21:57 2018
From: Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de (Katrin Fischer)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 16:21:57 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <CAMSJbVtB4KrPAEQ3Q=PA_Smj_Niv8_pHcqDZukEt2VmTB_T1EQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
	<e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
	<74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>
	<CAMSJbVtB4KrPAEQ3Q=PA_Smj_Niv8_pHcqDZukEt2VmTB_T1EQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <trinity-63ae0152-6728-4b69-95fa-ceb61edac91e-1542640917755@3c-app-webde-bs19>

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From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Mon Nov 19 16:30:19 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 15:30:19 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <trinity-63ae0152-6728-4b69-95fa-ceb61edac91e-1542640917755@3c-app-webde-bs19>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
	<e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
	<74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>
	<CAMSJbVtB4KrPAEQ3Q=PA_Smj_Niv8_pHcqDZukEt2VmTB_T1EQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<trinity-63ae0152-6728-4b69-95fa-ceb61edac91e-1542640917755@3c-app-webde-bs19>
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8Ct0bu0fW4GBz+_2iCoX6u-00fPABvDuc3CP_WvtE2WAg@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with Katrin here, I have been slowly working manual submissions
into my QA workflow with requests for patch authors to submit a
corresponding manual submission at the same time as the Bugzilla entry.

Documenting notices feels like it fits in nicely with that.. rather than
requiring double work (POD + Manual) we should be requiring just one place
be updated.

I'd have no issues with adding a specific coding guideline for this sort of
thing however.. right now I just encourage corresponding manual merge
requests but I can't really Fail QA on a patch that doesn't have one.

*Martin Renvoize*

<https://www.ptfs-europe.com>

Development Team Manager





*Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728

*Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636

*Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com

*Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384


www.ptfs-europe.com







Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30

The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
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error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com



On Mon, 19 Nov 2018 at 15:22, Katrin Fischer <Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de>
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I feel if we want one source of truth besides the source code, it would
> make sense to submit patches to the manual directly instead of adding more
> documentation outside of it. Adding a POD file will need another person to
> work on adding it to the manual regularly. Let's not make things more
> complicated!
>
> Katrin
>
> *Gesendet:* Montag, 19. November 2018 um 16:15 Uhr
> *Von:* "Barton Chittenden" <barton at bywatersolutions.com>
> *An:* sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com
> *Cc:* Koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Betreff:* Re: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
> The field guide is based on the wiki page, which I maintained... but I
> think that developers should be documenting any notices they add, which is
> why I've added this to the agenda for Wednesday's dev meeting:
>
> *Review of coding guidelines*
>
>    - Proposed coding guideline DOC2: Entries in the *letter* table must
>    be documented in *Koha/Notices.pod*. See Bug 21858 - RFC: Notices and
>    slips documentation
>    <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21858>
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 8:55 AM Sophie Meynieux <
> sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks,
>> It's ok with the url but you can't find it (or I can't find it) directly
>> on 18.05 documentation page
>>
>> Sophie
>>
>> --
>> Responsable support
>> BibLibre
>> + 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
>> http://www.biblibre.com
>>
>> Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:44, Michael Kuhn a ?crit :
>> > Hi Sophie
>> >
>> > > Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha
>> > > documentation
>> > >
>> > (
>> https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips
>> )
>> >
>> > > but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05
>> >
>> > For Koha 18.05 you can find the field guide at
>> >
>> >
>> https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips
>> >
>> >
>> > Best wishes: Michael
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
> _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git :
> http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Mon Nov 19 16:36:11 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 15:36:11 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <f2727f35-8bd1-c5ee-9d9e-38d0f5bdda50@helsinki.fi>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<0e4e9067-ff85-6ccb-1f25-7cd6c35bea80@biblibre.com>
	<f2727f35-8bd1-c5ee-9d9e-38d0f5bdda50@helsinki.fi>
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8CdbfzjjwE89ozpxxpHr=QKa2AKYwjXR3kd7ugL-HxfNQ@mail.gmail.com>

So who fancies sponsoring that cleanup... it's been on my "Wouldn't it be
nice to do" list for years ;)

*Martin Renvoize*

<https://www.ptfs-europe.com>

Development Team Manager





*Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728

*Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636

*Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com

*Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384


www.ptfs-europe.com







Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30

The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com



On Mon, 19 Nov 2018 at 13:52, Ere Maijala <ere.maijala at helsinki.fi> wrote:

> Phew! :)
>
> Paul Poulain kirjoitti 19.11.2018 klo 15.41:
> >  From my side it was a joke: we will integrate the new standards, no
> > doubts, but we'll do it more cleanly than using biblio/biblioitems/items
> !
> >
> > Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:39, Ere Maijala a ?crit :
> >> If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er)
> >> slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately.
> >
>
> --
> Ere Maijala
> Kansalliskirjasto / The National Library of Finland
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From bargioni at pusc.it  Mon Nov 19 16:58:01 2018
From: bargioni at pusc.it (Stefano Bargioni)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 16:58:01 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
Message-ID: <35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>

Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
Stefano 

[1] https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
[2] http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA

> On 19 Nov 2018, at 14:39, Ere Maijala <ere.maijala at helsinki.fi> wrote:
> 
> If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er) slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately.
> 
> --Ere
> 
> Marcel de Rooy kirjoitti 19.11.2018 klo 15.08:
>> Three levels in BIBFrame again ?
>> *Van:* koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> *Namens *Tomas Cohen Arazi
>> *Verzonden:* maandag 19 november 2018 14:02
>> *Aan:* Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
>> *CC:* koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>> *Onderwerp:* Re: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
>> Great info, Paul!
>> We now removed the marc/marcxml columns from biblioitems too, so it makes more sense to merge them.
>> El lun., 19 nov. 2018 a las 6:02, Paul Poulain (<paul.poulain at biblibre.com <mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>) escribi?:
>>    <wise-old-man mode ON>
>>    Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR compliant
>>    software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not
>>    innovative :D )
>>    More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio
>>    description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more expression
>>    of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN
>>    the different items. Very efficient and handy.
>>    When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management
>>    (MARC
>>    has only 2 levels, biblio and items).
>>    In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc" cataloguing.
>>    It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing
>>    remained.
>>    At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been merged,
>>    but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we want
>>    to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )
>>    <wise-old-man mode OFF>
>>    Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit :
>>     > Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There should
>>     > be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem
>>     > records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for
>>     > biblioitems?
>>     >
>>     > --Barton
>>    --     Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
>>    BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
>>    BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
>>    _______________________________________________
>>    Koha-devel mailing list
>>    Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>>    <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>>    http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>>    website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>>    git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>>    bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>> -- 
>> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
>> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io <http://theke.io/>)
>> ?+54 9351 3513384
>> GPG: B2F3C15F
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> 
> -- 
> Ere Maijala
> Kansalliskirjasto / The National Library of Finland
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/


From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Mon Nov 19 17:05:41 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 11:05:41 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
In-Reply-To: <CAB7SL8Ct0bu0fW4GBz+_2iCoX6u-00fPABvDuc3CP_WvtE2WAg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSJbVuxw+0vgvdqYr8QZ72M0HexN=UUymVL+Y08cdVPdwD28A@mail.gmail.com>
	<ceb3524d-8995-aacf-7b49-4fb7d54383a7@biblibre.com>
	<e2fd7420-407f-5c7d-d63b-cb259bc1c492@adminkuhn.ch>
	<74849f4b-bf5a-76bb-50fc-a2a27ae92c10@biblibre.com>
	<CAMSJbVtB4KrPAEQ3Q=PA_Smj_Niv8_pHcqDZukEt2VmTB_T1EQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<trinity-63ae0152-6728-4b69-95fa-ceb61edac91e-1542640917755@3c-app-webde-bs19>
	<CAB7SL8Ct0bu0fW4GBz+_2iCoX6u-00fPABvDuc3CP_WvtE2WAg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVtP6784idh4ND8QX_7=7fSXSYXUOVj0Q5cXp2UBwVpiUA@mail.gmail.com>

I see your point about eliminating duplication of effort... somewhat less
so about failing QA for lack of documentation... undocumented features
become a support issue, and that falls in my lap ;-).

--Barton

On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 10:30 AM Renvoize, Martin <
martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com> wrote:

> I agree with Katrin here, I have been slowly working manual submissions
> into my QA workflow with requests for patch authors to submit a
> corresponding manual submission at the same time as the Bugzilla entry.
>
> Documenting notices feels like it fits in nicely with that.. rather than
> requiring double work (POD + Manual) we should be requiring just one place
> be updated.
>
> I'd have no issues with adding a specific coding guideline for this sort
> of thing however.. right now I just encourage corresponding manual merge
> requests but I can't really Fail QA on a patch that doesn't have one.
>
> *Martin Renvoize*
>
> <https://www.ptfs-europe.com>
>
> Development Team Manager
>
>
>
>
>
> *Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728
>
> *Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636
>
> *Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com
>
> *Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384
>
>
> www.ptfs-europe.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30
>
> The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
> confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
> recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
> prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
> error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, 19 Nov 2018 at 15:22, Katrin Fischer <Katrin.Fischer.83 at web.de>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I feel if we want one source of truth besides the source code, it would
>> make sense to submit patches to the manual directly instead of adding more
>> documentation outside of it. Adding a POD file will need another person to
>> work on adding it to the manual regularly. Let's not make things more
>> complicated!
>>
>> Katrin
>>
>> *Gesendet:* Montag, 19. November 2018 um 16:15 Uhr
>> *Von:* "Barton Chittenden" <barton at bywatersolutions.com>
>> *An:* sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com
>> *Cc:* Koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>> *Betreff:* Re: [Koha-devel] Notices and slips documentation RFC
>> The field guide is based on the wiki page, which I maintained... but I
>> think that developers should be documenting any notices they add, which is
>> why I've added this to the agenda for Wednesday's dev meeting:
>>
>> *Review of coding guidelines*
>>
>>    - Proposed coding guideline DOC2: Entries in the *letter* table must
>>    be documented in *Koha/Notices.pod*. See Bug 21858 - RFC: Notices and
>>    slips documentation
>>    <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21858>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 8:55 AM Sophie Meynieux <
>> sophie.meynieux at biblibre.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> It's ok with the url but you can't find it (or I can't find it) directly
>>> on 18.05 documentation page
>>>
>>> Sophie
>>>
>>> --
>>> Responsable support
>>> BibLibre
>>> + 33 (0)4 91 81 35 08
>>> http://www.biblibre.com
>>>
>>> Le 19/11/2018 ? 14:44, Michael Kuhn a ?crit :
>>> > Hi Sophie
>>> >
>>> > > Until 17.11, there was a Field Guide for Notices and slips in Koha
>>> > > documentation
>>> > >
>>> > (
>>> https://koha-community.org/manual/17.11/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips
>>> )
>>> >
>>> > > but it seems to have desappeared in 18.05
>>> >
>>> > For Koha 18.05 you can find the field guide at
>>> >
>>> >
>>> https://koha-community.org/manual/18.05/en/html/17_miscellaneous.html#field-guide-for-notices-slips
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Best wishes: Michael
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Koha-devel mailing list
>>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>>
>> _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git :
>> http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Mon Nov 19 20:16:39 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2018 14:16:39 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
In-Reply-To: <35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVse_ycX=c-1MVWK0gM-0JEdDg07K8xMaPi2xgcfD7e25w@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Paul, that was interesting! I'm glad I asked :-)

On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 10:58 AM Stefano Bargioni <bargioni at pusc.it> wrote:

> Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me
> to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt
> definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
> Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links
> of any type.
> Stefano
>
> [1] https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
> [2] http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA
>
> > On 19 Nov 2018, at 14:39, Ere Maijala <ere.maijala at helsinki.fi> wrote:
> >
> > If three levels are needed in the future, I'd start from a clean(er)
> slate and at least make sure they're named appropriately.
> >
> > --Ere
> >
> > Marcel de Rooy kirjoitti 19.11.2018 klo 15.08:
> >> Three levels in BIBFrame again ?
> >> *Van:* koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <
> koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> *Namens *Tomas Cohen Arazi
> >> *Verzonden:* maandag 19 november 2018 14:02
> >> *Aan:* Paul Poulain <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>
> >> *CC:* koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> >> *Onderwerp:* Re: [Koha-devel] What is biblioitemnumber for?
> >> Great info, Paul!
> >> We now removed the marc/marcxml columns from biblioitems too, so it
> makes more sense to merge them.
> >> El lun., 19 nov. 2018 a las 6:02, Paul Poulain (<
> paul.poulain at biblibre.com <mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>) escribi?:
> >>    <wise-old-man mode ON>
> >>    Koha v1.x has no MARC support. In fact, it was the first FRBR
> compliant
> >>    software ever, long before FRBR exist... (who says Open Source is not
> >>    innovative :D )
> >>    More explanation: in Koha v1, you had to enter a minimal biblio
> >>    description (title, author(s), subject(s)) THEN one or more
> expression
> >>    of the work (one large print, one readed book, one pocket, ...), THEN
> >>    the different items. Very efficient and handy.
> >>    When I wrote the MARC code, I had to break this 3 level management
> >>    (MARC
> >>    has only 2 levels, biblio and items).
> >>    In Koha 2.0, you had the option to stay "basic" of "marc"
> cataloguing.
> >>    It has been removed in Koha ??? (2.2 or 3.0 ?), only MARC cataloguing
> >>    remained.
> >>    At this time biblioitems table became useless/should have been
> merged,
> >>    but no one coded/hacked it. But yes, it can be removed (unless we
> want
> >>    to keep it for future advanced support of FRBR :D )
> >>    <wise-old-man mode OFF>
> >>    Le 17/11/2018 ? 20:40, Barton Chittenden a ?crit :
> >>     > Just out of curiosity, why does biblioitemnumber exist? There
> should
> >>     > be a one-to-one relationship between biblio records and biblioitem
> >>     > records ... so why not use biblionumber as the primary key for
> >>     > biblioitems?
> >>     >
> >>     > --Barton
> >>    --     Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
> >>    BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
> >>    BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
> >>    _______________________________________________
> >>    Koha-devel mailing list
> >>    Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> >>    <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> >>    http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> >>    website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> >>    git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> >>    bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> >> --
> >> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
> >> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io <http://theke.io/>)
> >> ?+54 9351 3513384
> >> GPG: B2F3C15F
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Koha-devel mailing list
> >> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> >> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> >> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> >> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> >> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
> >
> > --
> > Ere Maijala
> > Kansalliskirjasto / The National Library of Finland
> > _______________________________________________
> > Koha-devel mailing list
> > Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> > http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> > website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> > git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> > bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Tue Nov 20 08:52:04 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2018 08:52:04 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Hackfest in Marseille in 2019
Message-ID: <1528b456-1c6b-639c-c35b-3b6e4ebcfcc0@biblibre.com>

Hello Koha,

I wrote a while ago that the hackfest in Marseille will not take place 
in spring, because of the KohaCon in Europe (congratulation Dublin).

We've chosen : sept 30th - oct 4th. It may be a little bit early to book 
your flight but you can already set the dates in your agenda ;)

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries


From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Tue Nov 20 13:57:57 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2018 13:57:57 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is
 biblioitemnumber for?]
In-Reply-To: <35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
Message-ID: <b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com>

Hello Stefano,

What you're pointing Stefano is very important: we must start our effort 
toward LRM.

Here is my 1st thoughts about it: I think that LRM support on Koha means 
2 things:

  * internal handling of the LRM model. This would mean breaking the
    biblio/items structure of the database, managing "LRM records" (if
    we have), proposing LRM cataloguing tools, and changing many many
    other things in Koha (like MARC staging, z39/50 search, ...) I feel
    that this will require years and a lot of work, and for now the
    national catalogs are not ready to propose that.
  * new search paradigm. What the Oslo Public Library made is very
    interesting. when you do a search, you get the works
    (author/title/copyright date), then can see the expressions that
    exists in the library (publication dates, material type/support),
    then the items. Example: XXXXX I don't know in US, italy or other
    countries, but in France the BNF is working hard on adding "LRM"
    fields in their catalogue. This is done by adding new MARC fields (a
    lot...), that will contain an ARK to the linked data (work, authors,
    place, subject, ...). Last week, there was a meeting at the BNF
    where they presented their plans for 2019. BibLibre has not yet
    started to investigate the effort to create a "LRM-UNIMARC-Elastic
    Search" in Koha, but, for sure that's something we'll investigate in
    2019. If anyone is willing to join the effort, let me know (even
    better: if you are interested in LRM-MARC21-Elastic, the idea being
    to have a flexible configuration). If anyone has information
    regarding LRM-MARC21-LoC plans, feel free to share !

Have I missed something ? What are your plan regarding IFLA-LRM ? What's 
next ?

Le 19/11/2018 ? 16:58, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit?:
> Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
> Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
> Stefano
>
> [1]https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
> [2]http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries

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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Wed Nov 21 02:29:53 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2018 12:29:53 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is
	biblioitemnumber for?]
In-Reply-To: <b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
	<b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com>
Message-ID: <020e01d48139$b4248c00$1c6da400$@prosentient.com.au>

I can?t speak to LRM at all, but it reminds me how perhaps we should start moving towards uncoupling some parts of Koha and thinking more about how the different aspects should/could interact with different metadata models. 

 

I think Paul has already targeted the most important thing and that?s search. Users don?t care what metadata model is in Koha. They just want to be able to find the resources they desire. So whatever we do? I think we should put OPAC users of Koha first and then work backwards. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Paul Poulain
Sent: Tuesday, 20 November 2018 11:58 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is biblioitemnumber for?]

 

Hello Stefano,

What you're pointing Stefano is very important: we must start our effort toward LRM.

Here is my 1st thoughts about it: I think that LRM support on Koha means 2 things:

*	internal handling of the LRM model. This would mean breaking the biblio/items structure of the database, managing "LRM records" (if we have), proposing LRM cataloguing tools, and changing many many other things in Koha (like MARC staging, z39/50 search, ...) I feel that this will require years and a lot of work, and for now the national catalogs are not ready to propose that.
*	new search paradigm. What the Oslo Public Library made is very interesting. when you do a search, you get the works (author/title/copyright date), then can see the expressions that exists in the library (publication dates, material type/support), then the items. Example: XXXXX I don't know in US, italy or other countries, but in France the BNF is working hard on adding "LRM" fields in their catalogue. This is done by adding new MARC fields (a lot...), that will contain an ARK to the linked data (work, authors, place, subject, ...). Last week, there was a meeting at the BNF where they presented their plans for 2019. BibLibre has not yet started to investigate the effort to create a "LRM-UNIMARC-Elastic Search" in Koha, but, for sure that's something we'll investigate in 2019. If anyone is willing to join the effort, let me know (even better: if you are interested in LRM-MARC21-Elastic, the idea being to have a flexible configuration). If anyone has information regarding LRM-MARC21-LoC plans, feel free to share !

Have I missed something ? What are your plan regarding IFLA-LRM ? What's next ?

Le 19/11/2018 ? 16:58, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit :

Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
Stefano 
 
[1] https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
[2] http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Wed Nov 21 02:32:23 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2018 12:32:23 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is
	biblioitemnumber for?]
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
	<b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com> 
Message-ID: <021301d4813a$0da41390$28ec3ab0$@prosentient.com.au>

Recently, I used a discovery layer for a public library of which I?m a member, and I was so frustrated, as the search interface was so poorly designed. I spent minutes trying to find my resource but I couldn?t do anything but put keywords into a box, which did not retrieve the resource. Fortunately, I was able to fallback to their legacy catalogue where the search only took me 2 seconds to find the resource. 

 

But it?s a reminder that the people who matter most are the users of the library system. If that library loses their legacy catalogue, I?ll probably just stop using that library, as the discovery layer search interface was useless.

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: David Cook [mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au] 
Sent: Wednesday, 21 November 2018 12:30 PM
To: 'Paul Poulain' <paul.poulain at biblibre.com>; 'koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: RE: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is biblioitemnumber for?]

 

I can?t speak to LRM at all, but it reminds me how perhaps we should start moving towards uncoupling some parts of Koha and thinking more about how the different aspects should/could interact with different metadata models. 

 

I think Paul has already targeted the most important thing and that?s search. Users don?t care what metadata model is in Koha. They just want to be able to find the resources they desire. So whatever we do? I think we should put OPAC users of Koha first and then work backwards. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>  [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Paul Poulain
Sent: Tuesday, 20 November 2018 11:58 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is biblioitemnumber for?]

 

Hello Stefano,

What you're pointing Stefano is very important: we must start our effort toward LRM.

Here is my 1st thoughts about it: I think that LRM support on Koha means 2 things:

*	internal handling of the LRM model. This would mean breaking the biblio/items structure of the database, managing "LRM records" (if we have), proposing LRM cataloguing tools, and changing many many other things in Koha (like MARC staging, z39/50 search, ...) I feel that this will require years and a lot of work, and for now the national catalogs are not ready to propose that.
*	new search paradigm. What the Oslo Public Library made is very interesting. when you do a search, you get the works (author/title/copyright date), then can see the expressions that exists in the library (publication dates, material type/support), then the items. Example: XXXXX I don't know in US, italy or other countries, but in France the BNF is working hard on adding "LRM" fields in their catalogue. This is done by adding new MARC fields (a lot...), that will contain an ARK to the linked data (work, authors, place, subject, ...). Last week, there was a meeting at the BNF where they presented their plans for 2019. BibLibre has not yet started to investigate the effort to create a "LRM-UNIMARC-Elastic Search" in Koha, but, for sure that's something we'll investigate in 2019. If anyone is willing to join the effort, let me know (even better: if you are interested in LRM-MARC21-Elastic, the idea being to have a flexible configuration). If anyone has information regarding LRM-MARC21-LoC plans, feel free to share !

Have I missed something ? What are your plan regarding IFLA-LRM ? What's next ?

Le 19/11/2018 ? 16:58, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit :

Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
Stefano 
 
[1] https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
[2] http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
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From bargioni at pusc.it  Wed Nov 21 13:07:11 2018
From: bargioni at pusc.it (Stefano Bargioni)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2018 13:07:11 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is
 biblioitemnumber for?]
In-Reply-To: <021301d4813a$0da41390$28ec3ab0$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
	<b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com>
	<021301d4813a$0da41390$28ec3ab0$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <AAC0BC7E-A3FC-4844-AF0A-D6DFB8781F97@pusc.it>

I also like to speak from a "cataloguer first" point of view.
I mean: with RDA and LRM, cataloguing is moving to ... catalinking [1]. It is an intellectual job, that the staff UI has to support. Of course, in the background a robust data structure (oriented to objects and links among them) is required.
And good (linked) data are IMHO necessary to build a powerful search interface.
So, can Koha evolve up to this vision, where maybe Bibframe and MARC21+RDA have to be present at the same time? A lot of work, I'm sure, that requires (not only) new funds.
Ciao. Stefano 

[1] https://www.flickr.com/photos/steveb59/14262929380/in/album-72157648757917805/ <https://www.flickr.com/photos/steveb59/14262929380/in/album-72157648757917805/>

> On 21 Nov 2018, at 02:32, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au> wrote:
> 
> Recently, I used a discovery layer for a public library of which I?m a member, and I was so frustrated, as the search interface was so poorly designed. I spent minutes trying to find my resource but I couldn?t do anything but put keywords into a box, which did not retrieve the resource. Fortunately, I was able to fallback to their legacy catalogue where the search only took me 2 seconds to find the resource. 
>  
> But it?s a reminder that the people who matter most are the users of the library system. If that library loses their legacy catalogue, I?ll probably just stop using that library, as the discovery layer search interface was useless.
>  
> David Cook
> Systems Librarian
> Prosentient Systems
> 72/330 Wattle St
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
> Australia
>  
> Office: 02 9212 0899
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>  
> From: David Cook [mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au>] 
> Sent: Wednesday, 21 November 2018 12:30 PM
> To: 'Paul Poulain' <paul.poulain at biblibre.com <mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>; 'koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>>
> Subject: RE: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is biblioitemnumber for?]
>  
> I can?t speak to LRM at all, but it reminds me how perhaps we should start moving towards uncoupling some parts of Koha and thinking more about how the different aspects should/could interact with different metadata models. 
>  
> I think Paul has already targeted the most important thing and that?s search. Users don?t care what metadata model is in Koha. They just want to be able to find the resources they desire. So whatever we do? I think we should put OPAC users of Koha first and then work backwards. 
>  
> David Cook
> Systems Librarian
> Prosentient Systems
> 72/330 Wattle St
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
> Australia
>  
> Office: 02 9212 0899
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>  
> From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>] On Behalf Of Paul Poulain
> Sent: Tuesday, 20 November 2018 11:58 PM
> To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is biblioitemnumber for?]
>  
> Hello Stefano,
> 
> What you're pointing Stefano is very important: we must start our effort toward LRM.
> 
> Here is my 1st thoughts about it: I think that LRM support on Koha means 2 things:
> 
> internal handling of the LRM model. This would mean breaking the biblio/items structure of the database, managing "LRM records" (if we have), proposing LRM cataloguing tools, and changing many many other things in Koha (like MARC staging, z39/50 search, ...) I feel that this will require years and a lot of work, and for now the national catalogs are not ready to propose that.
> new search paradigm. What the Oslo Public Library made is very interesting. when you do a search, you get the works (author/title/copyright date), then can see the expressions that exists in the library (publication dates, material type/support), then the items. Example: XXXXX I don't know in US, italy or other countries, but in France the BNF is working hard on adding "LRM" fields in their catalogue. This is done by adding new MARC fields (a lot...), that will contain an ARK to the linked data (work, authors, place, subject, ...). Last week, there was a meeting at the BNF where they presented their plans for 2019. BibLibre has not yet started to investigate the effort to create a "LRM-UNIMARC-Elastic Search" in Koha, but, for sure that's something we'll investigate in 2019. If anyone is willing to join the effort, let me know (even better: if you are interested in LRM-MARC21-Elastic, the idea being to have a flexible configuration). If anyone has information regarding LRM-MARC21-LoC plans, feel free to share !
> Have I missed something ? What are your plan regarding IFLA-LRM ? What's next ?
> 
> Le 19/11/2018 ? 16:58, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit :
>> Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
>> Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
>> Stefano 
>>  
>> [1] https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412 <https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412>
>> [2] http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA <http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA>-- 
> Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
> BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
> BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/

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From paul.poulain at biblibre.com  Wed Nov 21 14:04:17 2018
From: paul.poulain at biblibre.com (Paul Poulain)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2018 14:04:17 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is
 biblioitemnumber for?]
In-Reply-To: <AAC0BC7E-A3FC-4844-AF0A-D6DFB8781F97@pusc.it>
References: <CAMSJbVtVXyMYYH2QfyY=p3qocDtnRmo_GWF+SgejWRsqfgyUWA@mail.gmail.com>
	<f5603738-daec-c653-2cbd-90743954f69c@biblibre.com>
	<CABZfb=Wh5GUEQUnJAkMD-Gz9qr_-SqeiKrTfKRjX3E0VryF6zg@mail.gmail.com>
	<AM6PR05MB5976BDE56155B0B7156E3001CED80@AM6PR05MB5976.eurprd05.prod.outlook.com>
	<811bfe97-5271-7707-a6b6-7342b2c4dde3@helsinki.fi>
	<35BF4B43-9C1F-480A-9B55-308847E728CA@pusc.it>
	<b08c8ea7-8a81-15ad-bbca-9e3eac0db44b@biblibre.com>
	<021301d4813a$0da41390$28ec3ab0$@prosentient.com.au>
	<AAC0BC7E-A3FC-4844-AF0A-D6DFB8781F97@pusc.it>
Message-ID: <c3349c8e-82b9-427b-d35e-7813d97bc3ff@biblibre.com>

I agree with the idea of catalinking, and/but I think that most of the 
catalinking will be done by national repos (like BNF, LoC, ...)

That's why I think/feel that we should focus on linked data display 
first. And that's one of the reason why we (BibLibre) started the 
"Explore" project (see my talk at the KohaCon18 : 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIByWcvIj5Q)

we're continuing to investigate, try, fail, retry, ...

I also think that academic library point of view will differ a little 
bit from public library pov.


Le 21/11/2018 ? 13:07, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit?:
> I also like to speak from a "cataloguer first" point of view.
> I mean: with RDA and LRM, cataloguing is moving to ... catalinking 
> [1]. It is an intellectual job, that the staff UI has to support. Of 
> course, in the background a robust data structure (oriented to objects 
> and links among them) is required.
> And good (linked) data are IMHO necessary to build a powerful search 
> interface.
> So, can Koha evolve up to this vision, where maybe Bibframe and 
> MARC21+RDA have to be present at the same time? A lot of work, I'm 
> sure, that requires (not only) new funds.
> Ciao. Stefano
>
> [1] 
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/steveb59/14262929380/in/album-72157648757917805/
>
>> On 21 Nov 2018, at 02:32, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au 
>> <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au>> wrote:
>>
>> Recently, I used a discovery layer for a public library of which I?m 
>> a member, and I was so frustrated, as the search interface was so 
>> poorly designed. I spent minutes trying to find my resource but I 
>> couldn?t do anything but put keywords into a box, which did not 
>> retrieve the resource. Fortunately, I was able to fallback to their 
>> legacy catalogue where the search only took me 2 seconds to find the 
>> resource.
>> But it?s a reminder that the people who matter most are the users of 
>> the library system. If that library loses their legacy catalogue, 
>> I?ll probably just stop using that library, as the discovery layer 
>> search interface was useless.
>> David Cook
>> Systems Librarian
>> Prosentient Systems
>> 72/330 Wattle St
>> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>> Australia
>> Office: 02 9212 0899
>> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>> *From:*David Cook [mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au]
>> *Sent:*Wednesday, 21 November 2018 12:30 PM
>> *To:*'Paul Poulain' <paul.poulain at biblibre.com 
>> <mailto:paul.poulain at biblibre.com>>; 
>> 'koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org 
>> <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>' 
>> <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org 
>> <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>>
>> *Subject:*RE: [Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is 
>> biblioitemnumber for?]
>> I can?t speak to LRM at all, but it reminds me how perhaps we should 
>> start moving towards uncoupling some parts of Koha and thinking more 
>> about how the different aspects should/could interact with different 
>> metadata models.
>> I think Paul has already targeted the most important thing and that?s 
>> search. Users don?t care what metadata model is in Koha. They just 
>> want to be able to find the resources they desire. So whatever we do? 
>> I think we should put OPAC users of Koha first and then work backwards.
>> David Cook
>> Systems Librarian
>> Prosentient Systems
>> 72/330 Wattle St
>> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>> Australia
>> Office: 02 9212 0899
>> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>> *From:*koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org 
>> <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>[mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org]*On 
>> Behalf Of*Paul Poulain
>> *Sent:*Tuesday, 20 November 2018 11:58 PM
>> *To:*koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org 
>> <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>> *Subject:*[Koha-devel] roadmap to LRM support ? [was Re: What is 
>> biblioitemnumber for?]
>>
>> Hello Stefano,
>>
>> What you're pointing Stefano is very important: we must start our 
>> effort toward LRM.
>>
>> Here is my 1st thoughts about it: I think that LRM support on Koha 
>> means 2 things:
>>
>>   * internal handling of the LRM model. This would mean breaking the
>>     biblio/items structure of the database, managing "LRM records"
>>     (if we have), proposing LRM cataloguing tools, and changing many
>>     many other things in Koha (like MARC staging, z39/50 search, ...)
>>     I feel that this will require years and a lot of work, and for
>>     now the national catalogs are not ready to propose that.
>>   * new search paradigm. What the Oslo Public Library made is very
>>     interesting. when you do a search, you get the works
>>     (author/title/copyright date), then can see the expressions that
>>     exists in the library (publication dates, material type/support),
>>     then the items. Example: XXXXX I don't know in US, italy or other
>>     countries, but in France the BNF is working hard on adding "LRM"
>>     fields in their catalogue. This is done by adding new MARC fields
>>     (a lot...), that will contain an ARK to the linked data (work,
>>     authors, place, subject, ...). Last week, there was a meeting at
>>     the BNF where they presented their plans for 2019. BibLibre has
>>     not yet started to investigate the effort to create a
>>     "LRM-UNIMARC-Elastic Search" in Koha, but, for sure that's
>>     something we'll investigate in 2019. If anyone is willing to join
>>     the effort, let me know (even better: if you are interested in
>>     LRM-MARC21-Elastic, the idea being to have a flexible
>>     configuration). If anyone has information regarding
>>     LRM-MARC21-LoC plans, feel free to share !
>>
>> Have I missed something ? What are your plan regarding IFLA-LRM ? 
>> What's next ?
>>
>> Le 19/11/2018 ? 16:58, Stefano Bargioni a ?crit?:
>>> Paul, very interesting the basic historic idea. What you wrote, helps me to say that with Elasticsearch, Koha has the possibility to adopt definitely the LRM [1] model, that is going to be implemented in RDA [2].
>>> Especially important IMHO are links among authorities. Or, better, links of any type.
>>> Stefano
>>> [1]https://www.ifla.org/publications/node/11412
>>> [2]http://www.rda-rsc.org/ImplementationLRMinRDA
>> -- 
>> Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
>> BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
>> BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha-devel mailing list
>> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org 
>> <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/

-- 
Paul Poulain, Associ?-g?rant / co-owner
BibLibre, Services en logiciels libres pour les biblioth?ques
BibLibre, Open Source software and services for libraries

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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Thu Nov 22 08:59:34 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2018 18:59:34 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
Message-ID: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>

Hi folks,

 

I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 

 

So I've put together my own project which you can find here:
https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker

 

The "build.sh" script is still rough around the edges, but it all works.
Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into "input" (generated
using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and filename), run a
container, run the build.sh script, and then when the process is done you
should have some Debian packages in your "output" directory which is shared
with your host computer. 

 

Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image
is pretty heavy, but that's because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.

 

The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
"build dependencies", although I think we could tweak the debian/control
file so that we don't have to install everything just to build the packages.


 

Also I couldn't get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so
I've turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they can
run would be cool. 

 

Anyway, just thought I'd share that with everyone. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Thu Nov 22 10:38:15 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2018 06:38:15 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>

David, try this

https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/

I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely. The
source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages building
and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process of the
results.

El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au> escribi?:

Hi folks,



I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else.



So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here:
https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker



The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works.
Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input?
(generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and
filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the
process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output?
directory which is shared with your host computer.



Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image
is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.



The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control
file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the
packages.



Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so
I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they
can run would be cool.



Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone.



David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia



Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Mon Nov 26 08:19:36 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 18:19:36 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>

Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?

 

I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be convenient.

 

I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

David, try this

 

https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/

 

I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely. The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process of the results.

 

El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:

Hi folks,

 

I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 

 

So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here: https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker

 

The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 

 

Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.

 

The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the packages. 

 

Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they can run would be cool. 

 

Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

 

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From chrisc at catalyst.net.nz  Mon Nov 26 08:51:18 2018
From: chrisc at catalyst.net.nz (Chris Cormack)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 20:51:18 +1300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>

More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because one of its depencies isn't packaged)

Chris 

On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au> wrote:
>Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some
>work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it
>in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?
>
> 
>
>I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that
>you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could
>be convenient.
>
> 
>
>I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build
>dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s
>?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by
>rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of
>dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  
>
> 
>
>David Cook
>
>Systems Librarian
>
>Prosentient Systems
>
>72/330 Wattle St
>
>Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
>Australia
>
> 
>
>Office: 02 9212 0899
>
>Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
> 
>
>From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
>Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
>To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
>Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
> 
>
>David, try this
>
> 
>
>https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/
>
> 
>
>I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely.
>The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages
>building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install
>process of the results.
>
> 
>
>El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au
><mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:
>
>Hi folks,
>
> 
>
>I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
>packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
>https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 
>
> 
>
>So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here:
>https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker
>
> 
>
>The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all
>works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into
>?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix
>and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when
>the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your
>?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 
>
> 
>
>Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker
>image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools
>are heavy.
>
> 
>
>The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
>?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the
>debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to
>build the packages. 
>
> 
>
>Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go
>so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that
>they can run would be cool. 
>
> 
>
>Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 
>
> 
>
>David Cook
>
>Systems Librarian
>
>Prosentient Systems
>
>72/330 Wattle St
>
>Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
>Australia
>
> 
>
>Office: 02 9212 0899
>
>Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
> 
>
> 

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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From fridolin.somers at biblibre.com  Mon Nov 26 16:45:16 2018
From: fridolin.somers at biblibre.com (Fridolin SOMERS)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 16:45:16 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 17.11.12 release
Message-ID: <0c8fda09-0032-5ed3-baa0-72a0c058b4fa@biblibre.com>

The Koha community is proud to announce the release of Koha 17.11.12.

This is a maintenance release.

The full release notes are available at 
https://koha-community.org/koha-17-11-12-release/

Debian packages will be upgraded in a few days.

Regards,

-- 
Fridolin SOMERS <fridolin.somers at biblibre.com>
BibLibre, France - software and system maintainer

From martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com  Mon Nov 26 17:18:51 2018
From: martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com (Renvoize, Martin)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 16:18:51 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.05.06 release
Message-ID: <CAB7SL8BePN1p0T1W1Guf2oL=V=ny6NEuRAX1XWaOQ27Zu8XLMQ@mail.gmail.com>

The Koha community is proud to announce the release of Koha 18.05.06.

This is my final release as the 18.05.x maintainer, but I will be returning
next cycle as the next stable (18.11) maintainer. The 18.05.x series will
live on in the capable hands of Lucas Gass and Jesse Maseto.

This is a maintenance release containing 67 bugfixes

The full release notes are available at
https://koha-community.org/koha-18-05-06-release/

Debian packages will be updated within a few days

Many thanks to everyone involved,

*Martin Renvoize*

<https://www.ptfs-europe.com>

Development Team Manager





*Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728

*Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636

*Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com

*Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384


www.ptfs-europe.com







Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30

The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Mon Nov 26 20:29:16 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 16:29:16 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.05.06 release
In-Reply-To: <CAB7SL8BePN1p0T1W1Guf2oL=V=ny6NEuRAX1XWaOQ27Zu8XLMQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB7SL8BePN1p0T1W1Guf2oL=V=ny6NEuRAX1XWaOQ27Zu8XLMQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=V3isgLYzrNWAA_h-pGHVJgv3OMW1N9OBuCtTFgHEZpNQ@mail.gmail.com>

Great job Martin. Thanks!

El lun., 26 de nov. de 2018 13:20, Renvoize, Martin <
martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com> escribi?:

> The Koha community is proud to announce the release of Koha 18.05.06.
>
> This is my final release as the 18.05.x maintainer, but I will be
> returning next cycle as the next stable (18.11) maintainer. The 18.05.x
> series will live on in the capable hands of Lucas Gass and Jesse Maseto.
>
> This is a maintenance release containing 67 bugfixes
>
> The full release notes are available at
> https://koha-community.org/koha-18-05-06-release/
>
> Debian packages will be updated within a few days
>
> Many thanks to everyone involved,
>
> *Martin Renvoize*
>
> <https://www.ptfs-europe.com>
>
> Development Team Manager
>
>
>
>
>
> *Phone:* +44 (0) 1483 378728
>
> *Mobile:* +44 (0) 7725 985 636
>
> *Email:* martin.renvoize at ptfs-europe.com
>
> *Fax:* +44 (0) 800 756 6384
>
>
> www.ptfs-europe.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Registered in the United Kingdom No. 06416372   VAT Reg No. 925 7211 30
>
> The information contained in this email message may be privileged,
> confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended
> recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly
> prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in
> error, please email the sender at info at ptfs-europe.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Tue Nov 27 01:32:33 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 11:32:33 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
Message-ID: <00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>

While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of other projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere, and it doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things. 

 

It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack of packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the pipeline. And when it is caught, then that dependency could be packaged, and the same packaged koha-common could be used. That seems to be a more standard way of handling the packaging process, no? 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Chris Cormack
Sent: Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Cc: 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because one of its depencies isn't packaged)

Chris 

On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?

 

I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be convenient.

 

I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >
Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

David, try this

 

https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/

 

I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely. The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process of the results.

 

El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:

Hi folks,

 

I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 

 

So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here: https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker

 

The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 

 

Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.

 

The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the packages. 

 

Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they can run would be cool. 

 

Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

 


-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

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From chrisc at catalyst.net.nz  Tue Nov 27 01:35:00 2018
From: chrisc at catalyst.net.nz (Chris Cormack)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 13:35:00 +1300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>

If you like, I note it's been working fine for over 8 years now.
And was packaged by 2 debian developers and a debian maintainer. I'd strongly resist changing it

Chris 

On 27 November 2018 1:32:33 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au> wrote:
>While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of
>other projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere,
>and it doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things. 
>
> 
>
>It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build
>dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack
>of packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the
>pipeline. And when it is caught, then that dependency could be
>packaged, and the same packaged koha-common could be used. That seems
>to be a more standard way of handling the packaging process, no? 
>
> 
>
>David Cook
>
>Systems Librarian
>
>Prosentient Systems
>
>72/330 Wattle St
>
>Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
>Australia
>
> 
>
>Office: 02 9212 0899
>
>Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
> 
>
>From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
>[mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Chris
>Cormack
>Sent: Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
>To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>Cc: 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
>Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
> 
>
>More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are
>packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install
>(because one of its depencies isn't packaged)
>
>Chris 
>
>On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook
><dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:
>
>Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some
>work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it
>in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?
>
> 
>
>I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that
>you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could
>be convenient.
>
> 
>
>I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build
>dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s
>?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by
>rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of
>dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  
>
> 
>
>David Cook
>
>Systems Librarian
>
>Prosentient Systems
>
>72/330 Wattle St
>
>Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
>Australia
>
> 
>
>Office: 02 9212 0899
>
>Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
> 
>
>From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
>Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
>To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au
><mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >
>Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
><mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
>Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
> 
>
>David, try this
>
> 
>
>https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/
>
> 
>
>I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely.
>The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages
>building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install
>process of the results.
>
> 
>
>El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au
><mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:
>
>Hi folks,
>
> 
>
>I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
>packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
>https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 
>
> 
>
>So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here:
>https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker
>
> 
>
>The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all
>works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into
>?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix
>and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when
>the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your
>?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 
>
> 
>
>Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker
>image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools
>are heavy.
>
> 
>
>The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
>?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the
>debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to
>build the packages. 
>
> 
>
>Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go
>so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that
>they can run would be cool. 
>
> 
>
>Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 
>
> 
>
>David Cook
>
>Systems Librarian
>
>Prosentient Systems
>
>72/330 Wattle St
>
>Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
>Australia
>
> 
>
>Office: 02 9212 0899
>
>Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
> 
>
> 
>
>
>-- 
>Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Tue Nov 27 01:54:58 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 11:54:58 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
	<B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>
Message-ID: <00b901d485eb$d1e4ab60$75ae0220$@prosentient.com.au>

There?s certainly something to be said for ?if it?s not broken, don?t fix it?. It certainly does work well enough. 

 

I seem to recall reading something years ago from Lars about some uncertainty on packaging full web applications, versus individual modules or DOTADIW programs, for Debian but I think that was about other details.  

 

I?m not really advocating for change. Really just asking questions about why things are done the way they?re done. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Chris Cormack [mailto:chrisc at catalyst.net.nz] 
Sent: Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:35 AM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>; koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: RE: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

If you like, I note it's been working fine for over 8 years now.
And was packaged by 2 debian developers and a debian maintainer. I'd strongly resist changing it

Chris 

On 27 November 2018 1:32:33 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of other projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere, and it doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things. 

 

It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack of packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the pipeline. And when it is caught, then that dependency could be packaged, and the same packaged koha-common could be used. That seems to be a more standard way of handling the packaging process, no? 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>  [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Chris Cormack
Sent: Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Cc: 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because one of its depencies isn't packaged)

Chris 

On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?

 

I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be convenient.

 

I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >
Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

David, try this

 

https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/

 

I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely. The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process of the results.

 

El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:

Hi folks,

 

I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 

 

So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here: https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker

 

The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 

 

Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.

 

The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the packages. 

 

Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they can run would be cool. 

 

Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

 


-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Tue Nov 27 01:56:57 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 21:56:57 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <00b901d485eb$d1e4ab60$75ae0220$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
	<B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00b901d485eb$d1e4ab60$75ae0220$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=VK-sdZuodHhgZW_hP0o=-3KwtVLPkbU-et6UqPz1EmEg@mail.gmail.com>

If I had time to spend on the subject, I would look for ways to build
Debian packages without the need to chroot. With that solved, it will be
very easy to create those pipelines for testing the packages.

El lun., 26 nov. 2018 a las 21:55, David Cook (<dcook at prosentient.com.au>)
escribi?:

> There?s certainly something to be said for ?if it?s not broken, don?t fix
> it?. It certainly does work well enough.
>
>
>
> I seem to recall reading something years ago from Lars about some
> uncertainty on packaging full web applications, versus individual modules
> or DOTADIW programs, for Debian but I think that was about other details.
>
>
>
> I?m not really advocating for change. Really just asking questions about
> why things are done the way they?re done.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* Chris Cormack [mailto:chrisc at catalyst.net.nz]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:35 AM
> *To:* David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>;
> koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> *Subject:* RE: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> If you like, I note it's been working fine for over 8 years now.
> And was packaged by 2 debian developers and a debian maintainer. I'd
> strongly resist changing it
>
> Chris
>
> On 27 November 2018 1:32:33 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of other
> projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere, and it
> doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things.
>
>
>
> It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build
> dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack of
> packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the pipeline.
> And when it is caught, then that dependency could be packaged, and the same
> packaged koha-common could be used. That seems to be a more standard way of
> handling the packaging process, no?
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org [
> mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
> <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>] *On Behalf Of *Chris
> Cormack
> *Sent:* Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
> *To:* koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> *Cc:* 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are
> packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because
> one of its depencies isn't packaged)
>
> Chris
>
> On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some
> work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in
> your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?
>
>
>
> I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you
> can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be
> convenient.
>
>
>
> I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build
> dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s
> ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by
> rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of
> dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com
> <tomascohen at gmail.com>]
> *Sent:* Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
> *To:* David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> *Cc:* koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Subject:* Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> David, try this
>
>
>
> https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/
>
>
>
> I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely.
> The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages
> building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process
> of the results.
>
>
>
> El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au> escribi?:
>
> Hi folks,
>
>
>
> I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
> packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
> https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else.
>
>
>
> So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here:
> https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker
>
>
>
> The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works.
> Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input?
> (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and
> filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the
> process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output?
> directory which is shared with your host computer.
>
>
>
> Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker
> image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are
> heavy.
>
>
>
> The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
> ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control
> file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the
> packages.
>
>
>
> Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so
> I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they
> can run would be cool.
>
>
>
> Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Tue Nov 27 02:10:36 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 12:10:36 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=VK-sdZuodHhgZW_hP0o=-3KwtVLPkbU-et6UqPz1EmEg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
	<B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00b901d485eb$d1e4ab60$75ae0220$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=VK-sdZuodHhgZW_hP0o=-3KwtVLPkbU-et6UqPz1EmEg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00c501d485ee$00ec3de0$02c4b9a0$@prosentient.com.au>

If you shared some of your ideas, Tomas, perhaps I could do some work on that one?

With https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker, I?m not using a chroot. I just use the debian:jessie parent image, install build tools, take the upstream tarball (generated via git archive), use dch to update the changelog, currently use apt-get -y build-dep koha to install the build dependencies, then run ?debuild?. The slowest bit of the process is installing those build dependencies.

 

(Full disclosure: I?m using DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck as I recall one of the tests causing a fatal error, and I put off analysing that until I had the build process nailed down in the docker. That?ll need revisiting.)

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:57 AM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
Cc: Chris Cormack <chrisc at catalyst.net.nz>; koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

If I had time to spend on the subject, I would look for ways to build Debian packages without the need to chroot. With that solved, it will be very easy to create those pipelines for testing the packages.

 

El lun., 26 nov. 2018 a las 21:55, David Cook (<dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >) escribi?:

There?s certainly something to be said for ?if it?s not broken, don?t fix it?. It certainly does work well enough. 

 

I seem to recall reading something years ago from Lars about some uncertainty on packaging full web applications, versus individual modules or DOTADIW programs, for Debian but I think that was about other details.  

 

I?m not really advocating for change. Really just asking questions about why things are done the way they?re done. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Chris Cormack [mailto:chrisc at catalyst.net.nz <mailto:chrisc at catalyst.net.nz> ] 
Sent: Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:35 AM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >; koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Subject: RE: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

If you like, I note it's been working fine for over 8 years now.
And was packaged by 2 debian developers and a debian maintainer. I'd strongly resist changing it

Chris 

On 27 November 2018 1:32:33 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of other projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere, and it doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things. 

 

It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack of packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the pipeline. And when it is caught, then that dependency could be packaged, and the same packaged koha-common could be used. That seems to be a more standard way of handling the packaging process, no? 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>  [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Chris Cormack
Sent: Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Cc: 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because one of its depencies isn't packaged)

Chris 

On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > wrote:

Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?

 

I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be convenient.

 

I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.  

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> >
Cc: koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> >
Subject: Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker

 

David, try this

 

https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/

 

I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely. The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process of the results.

 

El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au> > escribi?:

Hi folks,

 

I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else. 

 

So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here: https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker

 

The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works. Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input? (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output? directory which is shared with your host computer. 

 

Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are heavy.

 

The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the packages. 

 

Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they can run would be cool. 

 

Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

 


-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/




 

-- 

Tom?s Cohen Arazi

Theke Solutions (http://theke.io <http://theke.io/> )
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F

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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Tue Nov 27 02:12:03 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2018 22:12:03 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
In-Reply-To: <00c501d485ee$00ec3de0$02c4b9a0$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <032901d48239$4ea85b30$ebf91190$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=UHyzdO=uzarg8uUbO-Jj8ZhP_pHkYtA-Y_bC9F8XVDnA@mail.gmail.com>
	<003e01d48558$62ccc430$28664c90$@prosentient.com.au>
	<188C0764-C177-4DB4-B165-A58BAF063B9B@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00a701d485e8$b04ead00$10ec0700$@prosentient.com.au>
	<B8219906-F06A-4D60-B92B-60CCB331B21F@catalyst.net.nz>
	<00b901d485eb$d1e4ab60$75ae0220$@prosentient.com.au>
	<CABZfb=VK-sdZuodHhgZW_hP0o=-3KwtVLPkbU-et6UqPz1EmEg@mail.gmail.com>
	<00c501d485ee$00ec3de0$02c4b9a0$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=WQ_y7GBmd8j0dNJVcAMqDnavqj992KN3AyFVXpofcP=w@mail.gmail.com>

It's all here:

https://gitlab.com/tomascohen/koha-dpkg-docker

I thought it was documented on the Docker hub.

El lun., 26 nov. 2018 a las 22:10, David Cook (<dcook at prosentient.com.au>)
escribi?:

> If you shared some of your ideas, Tomas, perhaps I could do some work on
> that one?
>
> With https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker, I?m not using
> a chroot. I just use the debian:jessie parent image, install build tools,
> take the upstream tarball (generated via git archive), use dch to update
> the changelog, currently use apt-get -y build-dep koha to install the build
> dependencies, then run ?debuild?. The slowest bit of the process is
> installing those build dependencies.
>
>
>
> (Full disclosure: I?m using DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck as I recall one of
> the tests causing a fatal error, and I put off analysing that until I had
> the build process nailed down in the docker. That?ll need revisiting.)
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:57 AM
> *To:* David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> *Cc:* Chris Cormack <chrisc at catalyst.net.nz>; koha-devel <
> koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> If I had time to spend on the subject, I would look for ways to build
> Debian packages without the need to chroot. With that solved, it will be
> very easy to create those pipelines for testing the packages.
>
>
>
> El lun., 26 nov. 2018 a las 21:55, David Cook (<dcook at prosentient.com.au>)
> escribi?:
>
> There?s certainly something to be said for ?if it?s not broken, don?t fix
> it?. It certainly does work well enough.
>
>
>
> I seem to recall reading something years ago from Lars about some
> uncertainty on packaging full web applications, versus individual modules
> or DOTADIW programs, for Debian but I think that was about other details.
>
>
>
> I?m not really advocating for change. Really just asking questions about
> why things are done the way they?re done.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* Chris Cormack [mailto:chrisc at catalyst.net.nz]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 27 November 2018 11:35 AM
> *To:* David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>;
> koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> *Subject:* RE: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> If you like, I note it's been working fine for over 8 years now.
> And was packaged by 2 debian developers and a debian maintainer. I'd
> strongly resist changing it
>
> Chris
>
> On 27 November 2018 1:32:33 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> While I can see the utility of that usage, are there any examples of other
> projects doing that? I don?t think that I?ve seen that elsewhere, and it
> doesn?t seem like the Debian way of doing things.
>
>
>
> It seems to me that the Build-Depends should just be for build
> dependencies, and Depends should be for package dependencies. The lack of
> packaged dependencies could be caught in a different part of the pipeline.
> And when it is caught, then that dependency could be packaged, and the same
> packaged koha-common could be used. That seems to be a more standard way of
> handling the packaging process, no?
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org [
> mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
> <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>] *On Behalf Of *Chris
> Cormack
> *Sent:* Monday, 26 November 2018 6:51 PM
> *To:* koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> *Cc:* 'koha-devel' <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> More than just the tests. It also makes sure all the dependencies are
> packaged too. That way you can't build a package you can't install (because
> one of its depencies isn't packaged)
>
> Chris
>
> On 26 November 2018 8:19:36 PM NZDT, David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> Thanks for sharing that, Tomas. I thought that you?d already done some
> work on this, but it wasn?t jumping out at me the other day. Where?s it in
> your gitlab? Is it the koha-dpkg-docker repository?
>
>
>
> I?m curious though why one would use pbuilder in Docker. Is it so that you
> can use the base.tgz files to store the koha-perldeps? That could be
> convenient.
>
>
>
> I?m curious why we have every Koha Perl dependency in the build
> dependencies section. Is it for the sake of the tests? Surely Koha?s
> ?build? dependencies would be pretty low. Just whatever is needed by
> rewrite-Config.PL really? But I suppose the tests would have a lot of
> dependencies, which could be painful to enumerate separately.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
> *From:* Tomas Cohen Arazi [mailto:tomascohen at gmail.com
> <tomascohen at gmail.com>]
> *Sent:* Thursday, 22 November 2018 8:38 PM
> *To:* David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> *Cc:* koha-devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
> *Subject:* Re: Building Koha Debian packages in Docker
>
>
>
> David, try this
>
>
>
> https://hub.docker.com/r/koha/koha-dpkg/
>
>
>
> I basically maintain the base.tgz files outside of it. It works nicely.
> The source code is on my gitlab. The plan was to automate the packages
> building and eventually set a pipeline for also testing the install process
> of the results.
>
>
>
> El 22 nov. 2018 04:59, "David Cook" <dcook at prosentient.com.au> escribi?:
>
> Hi folks,
>
>
>
> I was wondering if anyone had a Docker image for building Koha Debian
> packages. I scouted around a bit and found this image from Jonathan
> https://gitlab.com/joubu/koha-dpkg-docker but nothing else.
>
>
>
> So I?ve put together my own project which you can find here:
> https://gitlab.com/minusdavid/koha-deb-builder-docker
>
>
>
> The ?build.sh? script is still rough around the edges, but it all works.
> Basically you build the Docker image, dump a tarball into ?input?
> (generated using git archive with a properly formatted prefix and
> filename), run a container, run the build.sh script, and then when the
> process is done you should have some Debian packages in your ?output?
> directory which is shared with your host computer.
>
>
>
> Happy to accept pull requests or talk about it in general. The Docker
> image is pretty heavy, but that?s because the Debian packaging tools are
> heavy.
>
>
>
> The build process is also a bit long because it has to install all the
> ?build dependencies?, although I think we could tweak the debian/control
> file so that we don?t have to install everything just to build the
> packages.
>
>
>
> Also I couldn?t get the tests to complete successfully on the first go so
> I?ve turned them off for now. Fixing the image or the tests so that they
> can run would be cool.
>
>
>
> Anyway, just thought I?d share that with everyone.
>
>
>
> David Cook
>
> Systems Librarian
>
> Prosentient Systems
>
> 72/330 Wattle St
>
> Ultimo, NSW 2007
>
> Australia
>
>
>
> Office: 02 9212 0899
>
> Direct: 02 8005 0595
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
>
> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
> ? +54 9351 3513384
> GPG: B2F3C15F
>


-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de  Tue Nov 27 18:36:48 2018
From: Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de (Holger Meissner)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 17:36:48 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a
	renew	failure email the next day
In-Reply-To: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <ed0ac08a1d1540c3aed3d8f1127ab66d@nExchange2.hsg.intra>

Hi David,

could you expand on this? It's intentional that autorenewal stops when a hold is placed. Do you want to change this behaviour?

Or would you like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on reserve" error message if both apply? Or a new message informing you about both?

What's the benefit of checking whether it's too early first?

Regards,
Holger


Von: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> Im Auftrag von David Cook
Gesendet: Freitag, 16. November 2018 05:58
An: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Betreff: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew failure email the next day

Hi all,

I've found a case where autorenewals will renew an item one day (e.g. Monday) and the next day (e.g. Tuesday) it will say that a hold has been found and that it can't renew the item. (Someone must've put a hold on the item between the two cronjob runs.)

It seems to me this is a bug in how C4::Circulation::CanBookBeRenewed is written.

The first check it makes is for holds and if it finds a hold it returns an error.

However, if you're using autorenewals, you should first check to see if it's too early to even bother renewing.

I'm just emailing here to see if anyone else is having this issue, or if anyone knows if there is already a Bugzilla issue open for it. It seems like there are a lot of autorenewal Bugzilla issues but I couldn't find anything. Figure asking first lessens the need for someone to mark one as a duplicate later.

David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595

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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Tue Nov 27 19:54:10 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 13:54:10 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] 18.11 Release
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>

HI All,

Just a heads up the release is prepared, we are waiting on packages and
final details. Will let you know once it is all set and ready to go.

Your excited RM,
Nick
-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Tue Nov 27 19:55:06 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 15:55:06 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] 18.11 Release
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=WosAozFKg=p8CthvEyjMmdBXsxv8ScmXXXajn0M9qiPw@mail.gmail.com>

Woooooooooo

El mar., 27 nov. 2018 a las 15:54, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
escribi?:

> HI All,
>
> Just a heads up the release is prepared, we are waiting on packages and
> final details. Will let you know once it is all set and ready to go.
>
> Your excited RM,
> Nick
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From kyle.m.hall at gmail.com  Tue Nov 27 20:25:27 2018
From: kyle.m.hall at gmail.com (Kyle Hall)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 14:25:27 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] 18.11 Release
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACpVHfzWGAbjQwsSd6WC0kawnfkDZvv1v+c28OzOtZDUqn7vdw@mail.gmail.com>

\o/


Help me make Great Strides towards a cure for Cystic Fibrosis
<http://fightcf.cff.org/goto/kylehall>
<https://mail.google.com/>
---
http://www.kylehall.info
ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com )
Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org )
Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )


On Tue, Nov 27, 2018 at 1:54 PM Nick Clemens <nick at bywatersolutions.com>
wrote:

> HI All,
>
> Just a heads up the release is prepared, we are waiting on packages and
> final details. Will let you know once it is all set and ready to go.
>
> Your excited RM,
> Nick
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Tue Nov 27 21:50:20 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 15:50:20 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] [Koha] 18.11 Release
In-Reply-To: <CEB3319A384DF349947A4DA70B4C6610AC2E8188DD@PMHEXCMBV004.MEDSTAR.AD.MEDSTAR.NET>
References: <CAA_eX3Px__vZwHFezg6sxyzcvqAJNsA8+JYo-rH9hya9vLXuAg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CEB3319A384DF349947A4DA70B4C6610AC2E8188DD@PMHEXCMBV004.MEDSTAR.AD.MEDSTAR.NET>
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3N-63QyDHGqWgHjR1nHRUwbHN-ZYheyON6e12ozizvzPg@mail.gmail.com>

Unfortunately we hit an issue during the packaging, Mirko filed a bug here:
https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=21895

Any help is appreciated to get this cleared and the releas out the door.

On Tue, Nov 27, 2018 at 2:35 PM King, Fred <Fred.King at medstar.net> wrote:

> Congratulations! The Avenging Chicken is all aflutter.
>
> (New Adventure of Fred and the Avenging Chicken now available at
> avengingchicken.online.)
>
> Fred King
> Medical Librarian, MedStar Washington Hospital Center
> fred.king at medstar.net
> 202-877-6670 <(202)%20877-6670>
> ORCID 0000-0001-5266-0279
> MedStar Authors Catalog: http://medstarauthors.org
>
> Somehow it seems I managed to get old.  I really have no idea how that
> happened.
> --Brian Baker
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Koha [mailto:koha-bounces at lists.katipo.co.nz] On Behalf Of Nick
> Clemens
> Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2018 1:54 PM
> To: Koha Devel; Koha
> Subject: [Koha] 18.11 Release
>
>  ** ATTENTION: This email originated from outside the MedStar network. **
> DO NOT CLICK links or attachments unless you recognize the sender and know
> the content is safe.
>
> HI All,
>
> Just a heads up the release is prepared, we are waiting on packages and
> final details. Will let you know once it is all set and ready to go.
>
> Your excited RM,
> Nick
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha mailing list
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__koha-2Dcommunity.org&d=DwIGaQ&c=RvBXVp2Kc-itN3g6r3sN0QK_zL4whPpndVxj8-bJ04M&r=vKh6XwOmjyC51IkP1OfsdjQZoWT2vpi6VZl8El8EPRI&m=ZXpwywoqCo_W7t5U7qMTl5vDPYdgV4aOFFGJlQrW_R0&s=ftjfL5PNWFds8QAxaKkUIp35t-wrne4GKSuVE5GrTKs&e=
> Koha at lists.katipo.co.nz
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.katipo.co.nz_mailman_listinfo_koha&d=DwIGaQ&c=RvBXVp2Kc-itN3g6r3sN0QK_zL4whPpndVxj8-bJ04M&r=vKh6XwOmjyC51IkP1OfsdjQZoWT2vpi6VZl8El8EPRI&m=ZXpwywoqCo_W7t5U7qMTl5vDPYdgV4aOFFGJlQrW_R0&s=P0a7INpsKkieqzyWIPPoVDEZZjPICamcN6da1Osa-Gc&e=
>
-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Wed Nov 28 00:26:30 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2018 18:26:30 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Bugzilla search question
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVvzciCBPvO2DSejNbkEvsc=8dZ4LfOKU-0VUfg4KaHMiw@mail.gmail.com>

Is there any way to change the default statuses on the bugzilla advanced
search page? https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/query.cgi

The default statuses searched are NEW, REOPENED and ASSIGNED... which skips
bugs that are 'In Discussion', 'Needs Signoff', 'Signed off', 'Passed QA',
'Pushed for QA', 'Failed QA', 'Patch doesn't apply' or 'Pushed to
(Mater|Stable)'... in other words, most of the statuses that we use the
most.

I'd prefer to customize this on my own account, but it certainly wouldn't
hurt my feelings if the changes were made globally.

Thanks,

--Barton
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Wed Nov 28 01:24:28 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 11:24:28 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a
	renew	failure email the next day
In-Reply-To: <ed0ac08a1d1540c3aed3d8f1127ab66d@nExchange2.hsg.intra>
References: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>
	<ed0ac08a1d1540c3aed3d8f1127ab66d@nExchange2.hsg.intra>
Message-ID: <000201d486b0$b967f130$2c37d390$@prosentient.com.au>

Hi Holger,

 

Nope, I don't want to change autorenewal being stopped when a hold is
placed. 

 

Yes, I would like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on
reserve" error message if both apply. 

 

Here's my reasoning:

 

1)      Book A is due on September 1 2018

2)      Book A is autorenewed until September 15 2018

3)      Person B places a hold on Book A

4)      Koha shouldn't do anything until the threshold for autorenewal (e.g.
September 15 2018), because the item's status is on loan. 

 

In other words, autorenewal should be treated the exact same as manual
renewal. If Person A manually renews Book A on September 1 2018 making a new
due date of September 15 2018 and Person B puts a hold on Book A on
September 2 2018, nothing would happen until Person A tried to manually
renew Book A on September 15 2018. At that point, Koha would say they can't
renew because of a hold. 

 

Currently, people are getting emails telling them they can't autorenew their
book on September 2 2018 because someone has placed a hold, but this is a
misleading email, because on September 1 2018 their book was autorenewed
until September 15 2018. The email is illogical. 

 

It shouldn't be trying to autorenew because it's "too soon". Only when it's
otherwise renewable should we be checking for holds. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Holger Meissner [mailto:Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de] 
Sent: Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:37 AM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>;
koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: AW: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Hi David,

 

could you expand on this? It's intentional that autorenewal stops when a
hold is placed. Do you want to change this behaviour?

 

Or would you like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on
reserve" error message if both apply? Or a new message informing you about
both?

 

What's the benefit of checking whether it's too early first?

 

Regards,

Holger

 

 

Von: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
<koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> Im Auftrag von David Cook
Gesendet: Freitag, 16. November 2018 05:58
An: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Betreff: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Hi all,

 

I've found a case where autorenewals will renew an item one day (e.g.
Monday) and the next day (e.g. Tuesday) it will say that a hold has been
found and that it can't renew the item. (Someone must've put a hold on the
item between the two cronjob runs.)

 

It seems to me this is a bug in how C4::Circulation::CanBookBeRenewed is
written. 

 

The first check it makes is for holds and if it finds a hold it returns an
error. 

 

However, if you're using autorenewals, you should first check to see if it's
too early to even bother renewing. 

 

I'm just emailing here to see if anyone else is having this issue, or if
anyone knows if there is already a Bugzilla issue open for it. It seems like
there are a lot of autorenewal Bugzilla issues but I couldn't find anything.
Figure asking first lessens the need for someone to mark one as a duplicate
later.

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

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From nick at bywatersolutions.com  Wed Nov 28 13:57:55 2018
From: nick at bywatersolutions.com (Nick Clemens)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 07:57:55 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.11.00 released
Message-ID: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everybody,

It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release of
Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library
system.

This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and
community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their
contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward. None
of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out to
everyone who had a hand in the project

Read the full release notes here:
https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/

Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will
automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info here:
https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6

Thank you all,
Nick (kidclamp)


-- 
Nick Clemens
Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
ByWater Solutions
IRC: kidclamp
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From info at orex.es  Wed Nov 28 14:11:27 2018
From: info at orex.es (Hugo Agud)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 14:11:27 +0100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.11.00 released
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADT_QRRXKaZizNTG-u4FZbScdZJLCqQjEWOO4Kr-hPbpauTZBg@mail.gmail.com>

Congratulations!!!!!!

El mi?., 28 nov. 2018 a las 13:58, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
escribi?:

> Hello everybody,
>
> It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release of
> Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library
> system.
>
> This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and
> community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their
> contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward. None
> of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out to
> everyone who had a hand in the project
>
> Read the full release notes here:
> https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/
>
> Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will
> automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info here:
>
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6
>
> Thank you all,
> Nick (kidclamp)
>
>
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 

*www.orex.es <http://www.orex.es/>*


<http://www.orex.es/>    [image: www.orex.es/koha] <http://www.orex.es/koha>
    [image: www.orex.es/vufind] <http://www.orex.es/vufind>


Director

Avda Josep Tarradelles, 134 (Centro de Negocios Infanta) 08029 - Barcelona
- Tel: 933 856 138   hagud at orex.es ? http://www.orex.es/



No imprima este mensaje a no ser que sea necesario. Una tonelada de papel
implica la tala de 15 ?rboles y el consumo de 250.000 litros de agua.



Aviso de confidencialidad
Este mensaje contiene informaci?n que puede ser CONFIDENCIAL y/o de USO
RESTRINGIDO. Si usted no es el receptor deseado del mensaje (ni
est? autorizado a recibirlo por el remitente), no est? autorizado a copiar,
reenviar o divulgar el mensaje o su contenido. Si ha recibido este mensaje
por error, por favor, notif?quenoslo inmediatamente y b?rrelo de su sistema.
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From tomascohen at gmail.com  Wed Nov 28 14:20:45 2018
From: tomascohen at gmail.com (Tomas Cohen Arazi)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 10:20:45 -0300
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.11.00 released
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABZfb=X4uo2NNpD86kchdYOtRUKf8bYqrqzXH3Fg0EDikudQjQ@mail.gmail.com>

Congrats Nick and all! Lots of work and good stuff on a shiny new release!

El mi?., 28 nov. 2018 a las 9:58, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
escribi?:

> Hello everybody,
>
> It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release of
> Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library
> system.
>
> This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and
> community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their
> contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward. None
> of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out to
> everyone who had a hand in the project
>
> Read the full release notes here:
> https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/
>
> Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will
> automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info here:
>
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6
>
> Thank you all,
> Nick (kidclamp)
>
>
> --
> Nick Clemens
> Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> ByWater Solutions
> IRC: kidclamp
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/



-- 
Tom?s Cohen Arazi
Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
? +54 9351 3513384
GPG: B2F3C15F
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From amitddng135 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 28 14:28:32 2018
From: amitddng135 at gmail.com (Amit Gupta)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 18:58:32 +0530
Subject: [Koha-devel] [Koha]  Koha 18.11.00 released
In-Reply-To: <CABZfb=X4uo2NNpD86kchdYOtRUKf8bYqrqzXH3Fg0EDikudQjQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CABZfb=X4uo2NNpD86kchdYOtRUKf8bYqrqzXH3Fg0EDikudQjQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAA=k9sBodGiR9yB41KnHjEUpBXqKdY2DCm4Td=z3K4d9xC9tNA@mail.gmail.com>

Congrats Nick.

On Wed 28 Nov, 2018, 6:51 PM Tomas Cohen Arazi <tomascohen at gmail.com wrote:

> Congrats Nick and all! Lots of work and good stuff on a shiny new release!
>
> El mi?., 28 nov. 2018 a las 9:58, Nick Clemens (<nick at bywatersolutions.com
> >)
> escribi?:
>
> > Hello everybody,
> >
> > It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release
> of
> > Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library
> > system.
> >
> > This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and
> > community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their
> > contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward. None
> > of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out to
> > everyone who had a hand in the project
> >
> > Read the full release notes here:
> > https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/
> >
> > Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will
> > automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info
> here:
> >
> >
> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6
> >
> > Thank you all,
> > Nick (kidclamp)
> >
> >
> > --
> > Nick Clemens
> > Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
> > ByWater Solutions
> > IRC: kidclamp
> > _______________________________________________
> > Koha-devel mailing list
> > Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> > http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> > website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> > git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> > bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>
>
>
> --
> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
> ? +54 9351 3513384
> GPG: B2F3C15F
> _______________________________________________
> Koha mailing list  http://koha-community.org
> Koha at lists.katipo.co.nz
> https://lists.katipo.co.nz/mailman/listinfo/koha
>
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From barton at bywatersolutions.com  Wed Nov 28 15:42:40 2018
From: barton at bywatersolutions.com (Barton Chittenden)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 09:42:40 -0500
Subject: [Koha-devel] [Koha] Koha 18.11.00 released
In-Reply-To: <CAA=k9sBodGiR9yB41KnHjEUpBXqKdY2DCm4Td=z3K4d9xC9tNA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CABZfb=X4uo2NNpD86kchdYOtRUKf8bYqrqzXH3Fg0EDikudQjQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAA=k9sBodGiR9yB41KnHjEUpBXqKdY2DCm4Td=z3K4d9xC9tNA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSJbVuiG9SrKHoFwZt=s8xB-jZGeXqVvPfPH=gv4khi1qiF_Q@mail.gmail.com>

I will, forever after, congratulate the release manager on every release,
having seen the process (at least second hand).

Awesome job.

--Barton

On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 8:31 AM Amit Gupta <amitddng135 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Congrats Nick.
>
> On Wed 28 Nov, 2018, 6:51 PM Tomas Cohen Arazi <tomascohen at gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>> Congrats Nick and all! Lots of work and good stuff on a shiny new release!
>>
>> El mi?., 28 nov. 2018 a las 9:58, Nick Clemens (<
>> nick at bywatersolutions.com>)
>> escribi?:
>>
>> > Hello everybody,
>> >
>> > It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release
>> of
>> > Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library
>> > system.
>> >
>> > This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and
>> > community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their
>> > contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward.
>> None
>> > of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out
>> to
>> > everyone who had a hand in the project
>> >
>> > Read the full release notes here:
>> > https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/
>> >
>> > Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will
>> > automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info
>> here:
>> >
>> >
>> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6
>> >
>> > Thank you all,
>> > Nick (kidclamp)
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Nick Clemens
>> > Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)
>> > ByWater Solutions
>> > IRC: kidclamp
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Koha-devel mailing list
>> > Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
>> > http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
>> > website : http://www.koha-community.org/
>> > git : http://git.koha-community.org/
>> > bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tom?s Cohen Arazi
>> Theke Solutions (http://theke.io)
>> ? +54 9351 3513384
>> GPG: B2F3C15F
>> _______________________________________________
>> Koha mailing list  http://koha-community.org
>> Koha at lists.katipo.co.nz
>> https://lists.katipo.co.nz/mailman/listinfo/koha
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Koha-devel mailing list
> Koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
> website : http://www.koha-community.org/
> git : http://git.koha-community.org/
> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Thu Nov 29 00:19:21 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2018 10:19:21 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.11.00 released
In-Reply-To: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAA_eX3OUDo=CU7dAxnxcSLpGDCvr+h7WkyXBYLmqGywS9NhLAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00cb01d48770$cb13daf0$613b90d0$@prosentient.com.au>

Woohoo! Great job, kidclamp!

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Nick Clemens
Sent: Wednesday, 28 November 2018 11:58 PM
To: Koha <koha at lists.katipo.co.nz>; Koha Devel <koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: [Koha-devel] Koha 18.11.00 released

 

Hello everybody,

 

It is with great pleasure that the Koha community announces the release of Koha 18.11, a major release of the Koha open source integrated library system.

 

This release (as always) is the work of many librarians, developers, and community members who donate their time and effort to the project. Their contributions help shape the release, and the project going forward. None of this would be possible without them, and my sincere thanks goes out to everyone who had a hand in the project

 

Read the full release notes here:

https://koha-community.org/koha-18-11-release/

 

Debian packages are available, if you are following a suite you will automatically upgrade to the next branch with this release, more info here:

https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Koha_on_Debian#Follow_a_suite:_stable.2C_oldstable_.E2.80.A6

 

Thank you all,

Nick (kidclamp)

 

 

-- 

Nick Clemens

Sonic Screwdriver (Development Support)

ByWater Solutions

IRC: kidclamp

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From Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de  Thu Nov 29 15:28:53 2018
From: Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de (Holger Meissner)
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2018 14:28:53 +0000
Subject: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a
	renew	failure email the next day
In-Reply-To: <000201d486b0$b967f130$2c37d390$@prosentient.com.au>
References: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>
	<ed0ac08a1d1540c3aed3d8f1127ab66d@nExchange2.hsg.intra>
	<000201d486b0$b967f130$2c37d390$@prosentient.com.au>
Message-ID: <eb6f156e113143b38699672e2e9c3251@nExchange2.hsg.intra>

Thanks for the explanation, David.

> Yes, I would like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on reserve" error message if both apply.

I'd rather not. If patrons only know it's too early they will expect a renewal. Which won't happen, because of the hold we already know about. Why not tell them right away?
I would agree if holds were canceled most of the time, but in my estimate they aren't.

> Koha shouldn't do anything until the threshold for autorenewal (e.g. September 15 2018), because the item's status is on loan.

How would you implement something like that? The autorenew cronjob can't do nothing. It has to try and renew everything every time it runs.

> In other words, autorenewal should be treated the exact same as manual renewal. If Person A manually renews Book A on September 1
> 2018 making a new due date of September 15 2018 and Person B puts a hold on Book A on September 2 2018, nothing would happen
> until Person A tried to manually renew Book A on September 15 2018. At that point, Koha would say they can't renew because of a hold.

I believe they are treated equally, i.e. nothing prevents Person A from manually trying to renew again on September 2. And in that case they will see the hold.

> Currently, people are getting emails telling them they can't autorenew their book on September 2 2018 because someone has
> placed a hold, but this is a misleading email, because on September 1 2018 their book was autorenewed until September 15 2018. The email is illogical.

I'm probably missing something but I don't see what's illogical or misleading about it.

I think on hold > too many > too early is good precedence, because of the information they give. A patron might decide to return that book earlier if they know someone else is waiting, instead of just knowing that it won't be renewed anymore. And knowing that the book won't be renewed anymore is more useful information than just knowing that it's too early right now, even if all three apply at the same time.

Regards,
Holger

Von: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au>
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 28. November 2018 01:24
An: Holger Meissner <Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de>; koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Betreff: RE: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew failure email the next day

Hi Holger,

Nope, I don't want to change autorenewal being stopped when a hold is placed.

Yes, I would like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on reserve" error message if both apply.

Here's my reasoning:


1)      Book A is due on September 1 2018

2)      Book A is autorenewed until September 15 2018

3)      Person B places a hold on Book A

4)      Koha shouldn't do anything until the threshold for autorenewal (e.g. September 15 2018), because the item's status is on loan.

In other words, autorenewal should be treated the exact same as manual renewal. If Person A manually renews Book A on September 1 2018 making a new due date of September 15 2018 and Person B puts a hold on Book A on September 2 2018, nothing would happen until Person A tried to manually renew Book A on September 15 2018. At that point, Koha would say they can't renew because of a hold.

Currently, people are getting emails telling them they can't autorenew their book on September 2 2018 because someone has placed a hold, but this is a misleading email, because on September 1 2018 their book was autorenewed until September 15 2018. The email is illogical.

It shouldn't be trying to autorenew because it's "too soon". Only when it's otherwise renewable should we be checking for holds.

David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595

From: Holger Meissner [mailto:Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de]
Sent: Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:37 AM
To: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au<mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au>>; koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Subject: AW: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew failure email the next day

Hi David,

could you expand on this? It's intentional that autorenewal stops when a hold is placed. Do you want to change this behaviour?

Or would you like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on reserve" error message if both apply? Or a new message informing you about both?

What's the benefit of checking whether it's too early first?

Regards,
Holger


Von: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> <koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>> Im Auftrag von David Cook
Gesendet: Freitag, 16. November 2018 05:58
An: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
Betreff: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew failure email the next day

Hi all,

I've found a case where autorenewals will renew an item one day (e.g. Monday) and the next day (e.g. Tuesday) it will say that a hold has been found and that it can't renew the item. (Someone must've put a hold on the item between the two cronjob runs.)

It seems to me this is a bug in how C4::Circulation::CanBookBeRenewed is written.

The first check it makes is for holds and if it finds a hold it returns an error.

However, if you're using autorenewals, you should first check to see if it's too early to even bother renewing.

I'm just emailing here to see if anyone else is having this issue, or if anyone knows if there is already a Bugzilla issue open for it. It seems like there are a lot of autorenewal Bugzilla issues but I couldn't find anything. Figure asking first lessens the need for someone to mark one as a duplicate later.

David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia

Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595

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From dcook at prosentient.com.au  Fri Nov 30 00:35:35 2018
From: dcook at prosentient.com.au (David Cook)
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2018 10:35:35 +1100
Subject: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending
	a	renew	failure email the next day
In-Reply-To: <eb6f156e113143b38699672e2e9c3251@nExchange2.hsg.intra>
References: <00c401d47d68$f2c27cd0$d8477670$@prosentient.com.au>	<ed0ac08a1d1540c3aed3d8f1127ab66d@nExchange2.hsg.intra>	<000201d486b0$b967f130$2c37d390$@prosentient.com.au>
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Thanks for your feedback, Holger. 

 

Do you currently use autorenewals? I think you might be misunderstanding how
it works?

 

The precedence of "on hold > too many > too soon" is illogical for
autorenewal in my mind. When the autorenewal daily cronjob runs, it will
only send email alerts for "too many" and "on hold". The most common outcome
of the script should be "too soon" as it's during the normal loan period
before the due date, so it really should be the first check. If it's not
"too soon", then you try to process a renewal. The next step would be
checking if you have any renewals left. If not, then it's "too many". If you
do have renewals left, then you move to the next check, which would be
checking for holds. The logical precedence would be "too soon > too many >
on hold". 

 

"A patron might decide to return that book earlier if they know someone else
is waiting instead of just knowing that it won't be renewed anymore". That
seems to be a corruption/bleeding of scope for an autorenewal script. If you
want to notify patrons when someone places a hold on their loan so that they
can decide to return it out of courtesy, I'd recommend making adding a
different feature for that (and probably integrate it with recalls which
could optionally shorten the due date of the on loan item so the patron has
to return it earlier for the person who put the hold on it - recalls is a
common feature in other established ILS/LMS systems). 

 

"And knowing that the book won't be renewed anymore is more useful
information than just knowing that it's too early right now". Firstly, they
don't currently know that it's too early, as email notifications don't go
out for "too soon". Secondly, I have patrons returning their books when they
get the "can't autorenew because there is a hold", because they think that
their book has been recalled even though Koha thinks they actually have
several weeks left, because their loan was in fact successfully autorenewed
the day before they got the "on hold" email notification. 

 

At this point, librarians are getting annoyed at Koha for misleading
patrons, and I'm advising librarians to not use the autorenewal function as
a result. 

 

My options are as follows:

1)      Continue warning people that this feature doesn't work as they
expect, which doesn't look good for Koha

2)      Patch the script via the Koha community workflow, which is ideal for
developers and librarians

3)      Patch the script locally, which is far from ideal, but will make
librarians happy

 

I've been extremely busy, but it is my intention to submit a patch for this.
If there is enough disagreement about the order of steps, perhaps it would
be best to make the order of steps configurable. It wouldn't be a difficult
thing to do. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
[mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Holger
Meissner
Sent: Friday, 30 November 2018 1:29 AM
To: koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Thanks for the explanation, David.

 

> Yes, I would like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on
reserve" error message if both apply.

 

I'd rather not. If patrons only know it's too early they will expect a
renewal. Which won't happen, because of the hold we already know about. Why
not tell them right away?

I would agree if holds were canceled most of the time, but in my estimate
they aren't.

 

> Koha shouldn't do anything until the threshold for autorenewal (e.g.
September 15 2018), because the item's status is on loan.

 

How would you implement something like that? The autorenew cronjob can't do
nothing. It has to try and renew everything every time it runs.

 

> In other words, autorenewal should be treated the exact same as manual
renewal. If Person A manually renews Book A on September 1

> 2018 making a new due date of September 15 2018 and Person B puts a hold
on Book A on September 2 2018, nothing would happen

> until Person A tried to manually renew Book A on September 15 2018. At
that point, Koha would say they can't renew because of a hold. 

 

I believe they are treated equally, i.e. nothing prevents Person A from
manually trying to renew again on September 2. And in that case they will
see the hold.

 

> Currently, people are getting emails telling them they can't autorenew
their book on September 2 2018 because someone has

> placed a hold, but this is a misleading email, because on September 1 2018
their book was autorenewed until September 15 2018. The email is illogical.

 

I'm probably missing something but I don't see what's illogical or
misleading about it.

 

I think on hold > too many > too early is good precedence, because of the
information they give. A patron might decide to return that book earlier if
they know someone else is waiting, instead of just knowing that it won't be
renewed anymore. And knowing that the book won't be renewed anymore is more
useful information than just knowing that it's too early right now, even if
all three apply at the same time.

 

Regards,

Holger

 

Von: David Cook <dcook at prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au>
> 
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 28. November 2018 01:24
An: Holger Meissner <Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de
<mailto:Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de> >;
koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org> 
Betreff: RE: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Hi Holger,

 

Nope, I don't want to change autorenewal being stopped when a hold is
placed. 

 

Yes, I would like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on
reserve" error message if both apply. 

 

Here's my reasoning:

 

1)      Book A is due on September 1 2018

2)      Book A is autorenewed until September 15 2018

3)      Person B places a hold on Book A

4)      Koha shouldn't do anything until the threshold for autorenewal (e.g.
September 15 2018), because the item's status is on loan. 

 

In other words, autorenewal should be treated the exact same as manual
renewal. If Person A manually renews Book A on September 1 2018 making a new
due date of September 15 2018 and Person B puts a hold on Book A on
September 2 2018, nothing would happen until Person A tried to manually
renew Book A on September 15 2018. At that point, Koha would say they can't
renew because of a hold. 

 

Currently, people are getting emails telling them they can't autorenew their
book on September 2 2018 because someone has placed a hold, but this is a
misleading email, because on September 1 2018 their book was autorenewed
until September 15 2018. The email is illogical. 

 

It shouldn't be trying to autorenew because it's "too soon". Only when it's
otherwise renewable should we be checking for holds. 

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

From: Holger Meissner [ <mailto:Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de>
mailto:Holger.Meissner at hs-gesundheit.de] 
Sent: Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:37 AM
To: David Cook < <mailto:dcook at prosentient.com.au>
dcook at prosentient.com.au>;  <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Subject: AW: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Hi David,

 

could you expand on this? It's intentional that autorenewal stops when a
hold is placed. Do you want to change this behaviour?

 

Or would you like to get the "too soon" error message instead of the "on
reserve" error message if both apply? Or a new message informing you about
both?

 

What's the benefit of checking whether it's too early first?

 

Regards,

Holger

 

 

Von: koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org>
<koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org
<mailto:koha-devel-bounces at lists.koha-community.org> > Im Auftrag von David
Cook
Gesendet: Freitag, 16. November 2018 05:58
An:  <mailto:koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org>
koha-devel at lists.koha-community.org
Betreff: [Koha-devel] Autorenewals renewing an item then sending a renew
failure email the next day

 

Hi all,

 

I've found a case where autorenewals will renew an item one day (e.g.
Monday) and the next day (e.g. Tuesday) it will say that a hold has been
found and that it can't renew the item. (Someone must've put a hold on the
item between the two cronjob runs.)

 

It seems to me this is a bug in how C4::Circulation::CanBookBeRenewed is
written. 

 

The first check it makes is for holds and if it finds a hold it returns an
error. 

 

However, if you're using autorenewals, you should first check to see if it's
too early to even bother renewing. 

 

I'm just emailing here to see if anyone else is having this issue, or if
anyone knows if there is already a Bugzilla issue open for it. It seems like
there are a lot of autorenewal Bugzilla issues but I couldn't find anything.
Figure asking first lessens the need for someone to mark one as a duplicate
later.

 

David Cook

Systems Librarian

Prosentient Systems

72/330 Wattle St

Ultimo, NSW 2007

Australia

 

Office: 02 9212 0899

Direct: 02 8005 0595

 

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