To React or not to React
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297 Please give it a try! So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far. 1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem. 2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery. 3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React. 4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need. I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know! Kyle http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297 <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297>
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info <http://www.kylehall.info/> ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com <http://bywatersolutions.com/> ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org <http://www.meadvillelibrary.org/> ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org <http://www.ccfls.org/> ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Thanks for the feedback Stefano! Please, if anybody is *against* the use of React in Koha, please voice your concerns! Kyle <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:50 AM, Stefano Bargioni <bargioni@pusc.it> wrote:
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug. cgi?id=17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Can I not be against, yet still have concerns? :) I'm glad you so gallantly dumped Angular, which I would have raised my hand Against since that thing obsolete past code every 6 months. But I do not know React. Could you sell me more the big plusses to do that. What will it replace, do you have an example? What about all the code waiting approval right now, will it become obsolete because non-Reactive ? All the big previous changes (bootstrap, dbix...) were not without pain, espeicially for those outside the core, not coding these technologies 24/7. And how do you see React evolving in the next 5 years? Keeping up with bootstrap requires huge effort (if/when we upgrade). Again, I know little. Please don't ask me if I'm against, but give me your big sales pitch. :) Cheers, Philippe Blouin, Responsable du développement informatique Tél. : (888) 604-2627 philippe.blouin@inLibro.com <mailto:philippe.blouin@inLibro.com> inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com <http://www.inLibro.com> On 09/19/2016 08:18 AM, Kyle Hall wrote:
Thanks for the feedback Stefano!
Please, if anybody is *against* the use of React in Koha, please voice your concerns!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:50 AM, Stefano Bargioni <bargioni@pusc.it <mailto:bargioni@pusc.it>> wrote:
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com <mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com>> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297 <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297>
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info <http://www.kylehall.info/> ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com <http://bywatersolutions.com/> ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org <http://www.meadvillelibrary.org/> ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org <http://www.ccfls.org/> ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel <http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ <http://bugs.koha-community.org/>
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel <http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ <http://bugs.koha-community.org/>
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Since you're talking about JS/CSS Frameworks, what about Foundation? http://foundation.zurb.com/ This one is cool too! Best regards, Arthur Suzuki University Jean Moulin Lyon 3 Le 19/09/2016 à 14:33, Philippe Blouin a écrit :
Can I not be against, yet still have concerns? :)
I'm glad you so gallantly dumped Angular, which I would have raised my hand Against since that thing obsolete past code every 6 months. But I do not know React. Could you sell me more the big plusses to do that. What will it replace, do you have an example? What about all the code waiting approval right now, will it become obsolete because non-Reactive ?
All the big previous changes (bootstrap, dbix...) were not without pain, espeicially for those outside the core, not coding these technologies 24/7.
And how do you see React evolving in the next 5 years? Keeping up with bootstrap requires huge effort (if/when we upgrade).
Again, I know little. Please don't ask me if I'm against, but give me your big sales pitch. :)
Cheers,
Philippe Blouin, Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627 philippe.blouin@inLibro.com <mailto:philippe.blouin@inLibro.com>
inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com <http://www.inLibro.com> On 09/19/2016 08:18 AM, Kyle Hall wrote:
Thanks for the feedback Stefano!
Please, if anybody is *against* the use of React in Koha, please voice your concerns!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:50 AM, Stefano Bargioni <bargioni@pusc.it> wrote:
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info <http://www.kylehall.info/> ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel <http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ <http://bugs.koha-community.org/>
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel <http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel> website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ <http://bugs.koha-community.org/>
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website :http://www.koha-community.org/ git :http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs :http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
Arthur, I believe that foundation is an alternative to bootstrap. React JS is on the league of backbone, angular and ember. I have use React JS on a project and the best thing about it is the possibility of rewrite really small parts of the page. Create small widget to increase the functionality and keep turning the old page in a new way. One of the best thing for me about react is that is only frontend development so it has less impact on a migration and you can really decouple the backend. My cons are that the documentation is not that good, they want you to write the new code on ES6 but there is not that much documentation on that. Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack. Just my grain of sand! Cheers! On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 9:59 AM, SUZUKI Arthur <arthur.suzuki@univ-lyon3.fr> wrote:
Since you're talking about JS/CSS Frameworks, what about Foundation? http://foundation.zurb.com/ This one is cool too! Best regards, Arthur Suzuki University Jean Moulin Lyon 3
Le 19/09/2016 à 14:33, Philippe Blouin a écrit :
Can I not be against, yet still have concerns? :)
I'm glad you so gallantly dumped Angular, which I would have raised my hand Against since that thing obsolete past code every 6 months. But I do not know React. Could you sell me more the big plusses to do that. What will it replace, do you have an example? What about all the code waiting approval right now, will it become obsolete because non-Reactive ?
All the big previous changes (bootstrap, dbix...) were not without pain, espeicially for those outside the core, not coding these technologies 24/7.
And how do you see React evolving in the next 5 years? Keeping up with bootstrap requires huge effort (if/when we upgrade).
Again, I know little. Please don't ask me if I'm against, but give me your big sales pitch. :)
Cheers,
Philippe Blouin, Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627 philippe.blouin@inLibro.com inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com On 09/19/2016 08:18 AM, Kyle Hall wrote:
Thanks for the feedback Stefano!
Please, if anybody is *against* the use of React in Koha, please voice your concerns!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:50 AM, Stefano Bargioni <bargioni@pusc.it> wrote:
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing listKoha-devel@lists.koha-community.orghttp://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing listKoha-devel@lists.koha-community.orghttp://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Arthur SUZUKI Service informatique des bibliothèques BIBLIOTHÈQUES UNIVERSITAIRES Université Jean Moulin Lyon 3 6 Cours Albert Thomas - B.P. 8242 – 69355 Lyon Cedex 08 ligne directe : +33 (0)4 78 78 79 16 | http://bu.univ-lyon3.fr L'Université Jean Moulin est membre fondateur de l'Université de Lyon
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp? -- Owen -- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org
Sounds familiar. For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha. ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality. Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations? David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha.
ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality.
I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption.
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
I think I covered everyones questions. If I missed any or anyone has followups to my replies, please keep them coming! Koha *needs* a way for us to develop and use modern web practices. Koha has always evolved as the web has evolved. If it didn't, we'd still be using pure cgi-script with no javascript or ui layout framework! It's time for Koha to evolve a again, and it's a very small step compared to say the introduction of Bootstrap. React will just be another tool we can use to make Koha even better than before, and will not require changing much code at all to add, and does not affect any currently submitted patches. Again, please keep the questions and suggestions coming! Thanks to everyone who has joined in the discussion so far! Kyle <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 1:30 AM, Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny
to Koha.
ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality.
I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption.
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
We don't translate js files at the moment - which may be debatable. One benefit at the moment of keeping the strings only in the templates is that we don't copy the js files as we do with the template files. I think this should be solvable, but it's something to keep in mind.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
> -----Original Message----- > From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel- <mailto:koha-devel-> > bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:bounces@lists.koha-community.org>] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard > Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM > To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>> > Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React > > > Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another > > thing to throw on the stack. > > Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to > introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp? > > -- Owen > > -- > Web Developer > Athens County Public Libraries > http://www.myacpl.org > _______________________________________________ > Koha-devel mailing list > Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> > http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel <http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel> > website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- > community.org/ <http://community.org/> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ <http://bugs.koha-community.org/>
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Katrin I'm not quite sure what you mean. When I wrote we translate these files the same way we do other js files, I meant that we define the strings to be translated either in the script template file or in an include file and then only use the var storing the string in the js file. React is just Javascript and what we've been doing should work absolutely fine. I'll update my POC to be translatable when I get some time! If this is not what you meant Katrin, please let me know! Kyle <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:51 PM, Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> wrote:
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
We don't translate js files at the moment - which may be debatable. One benefit at the moment of keeping the strings only in the templates is that we don't copy the js files as we do with the template files. I think this should be solvable, but it's something to keep in mind.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing listKoha-devel@lists.koha-community.orghttp://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
I think Katrin and I both are probably referring to this file: <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/page.cgi?id=splinter.html&bug=17297&attachment=55545> https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/page.cgi?id=splinter.html&bug=17297&attachment=55545 It embeds HTML and hardcoded strings in the .js file. It would be great to see a translateable version. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595 From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Kyle Hall Sent: Tuesday, 20 September 2016 11:22 PM To: Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> Cc: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React Katrin I'm not quite sure what you mean. When I wrote we translate these files the same way we do other js files, I meant that we define the strings to be translated either in the script template file or in an include file and then only use the var storing the string in the js file. React is just Javascript and what we've been doing should work absolutely fine. I'll update my POC to be translatable when I get some time! If this is not what you meant Katrin, please let me know! Kyle <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:51 PM, Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de <mailto:katrin.fischer.83@web.de> > wrote: Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations? React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files. We don't translate js files at the moment - which may be debatable. One benefit at the moment of keeping the strings only in the templates is that we don't copy the js files as we do with the template files. I think this should be solvable, but it's something to keep in mind. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel- <mailto:koha-devel-> bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:bounces@lists.koha-community.org> ] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> > Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ <http://community.org/> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/ _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Yes, I'll definitely need to make it translatable! I'll do that along with building out the backend to make it a complete fully functioning feature. Kyle <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 6:17 PM, David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au> wrote:
I think Katrin and I both are probably referring to this file: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/page.cgi?id= splinter.html&bug=17297&attachment=55545
It embeds HTML and hardcoded strings in the .js file. It would be great to see a translateable version.
David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595
*From:* koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org] *On Behalf Of *Kyle Hall *Sent:* Tuesday, 20 September 2016 11:22 PM *To:* Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> *Cc:* Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
*Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Katrin I'm not quite sure what you mean. When I wrote we translate these files the same way we do other js files, I meant that we define the strings to be translated either in the script template file or in an include file and then only use the var storing the string in the js file. React is just Javascript and what we've been doing should work absolutely fine. I'll update my POC to be translatable when I get some time!
If this is not what you meant Katrin, please let me know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:51 PM, Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> wrote:
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
We don't translate js files at the moment - which may be debatable. One benefit at the moment of keeping the strings only in the templates is that we don't copy the js files as we do with the template files. I think this should be solvable, but it's something to keep in mind.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
You are looking at a POC, that doesn't have the endpoints it need to hit against, so it has some sample values in plain english. But a real implementation would of course use the usual _("blah") stuff, and have the strings defined in a translatable file/directory. El mar., 20 sept. 2016 a las 21:17, David Cook (<dcook@prosentient.com.au>) escribió:
I think Katrin and I both are probably referring to this file: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/page.cgi?id=splinter.html&bug=17297&attachment=55545
It embeds HTML and hardcoded strings in the .js file. It would be great to see a translateable version.
David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595
*From:* koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org] *On Behalf Of *Kyle Hall *Sent:* Tuesday, 20 September 2016 11:22 PM *To:* Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> *Cc:* Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
*Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Katrin I'm not quite sure what you mean. When I wrote we translate these files the same way we do other js files, I meant that we define the strings to be translated either in the script template file or in an include file and then only use the var storing the string in the js file. React is just Javascript and what we've been doing should work absolutely fine. I'll update my POC to be translatable when I get some time!
If this is not what you meant Katrin, please let me know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:51 PM, Katrin <katrin.fischer.83@web.de> wrote:
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
We don't translate js files at the moment - which may be debatable. One benefit at the moment of keeping the strings only in the templates is that we don't copy the js files as we do with the template files. I think this should be solvable, but it's something to keep in mind.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________
Koha-devel mailing list
Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org
http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel
website : http://www.koha-community.org/
git : http://git.koha-community.org/
bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
-- Tomás Cohen Arazi Theke Solutions (https://theke.io <http://theke.io/>) ✆ +54 9351 3513384 GPG: B2F3C15F
I think it differs in that a search engine and a RESTful API adds core functionality. Without them, we can’t really search or expose services. We already have a JS UI toolkit, which seems to be working fine. Why do you say that React is necessary and long overdue? In terms of your email, do you mean that it lets you do more with less code? I’m not necessarily opposed to that. I do get annoyed by having to write so much code to achieve small things at times. I suppose I’m curious as to the motivation behind React at this point. Aren’t there higher priorities for Koha right now? I suppose maybe that’s just my own naïveté speaking, and part of the joy of having so many developers on Koha is that we can all focus on different aspects of the system. Yet, shouldn’t there be some cohesion? Are our interfaces going to be a combination of plain JS, jQuery, Bootstrap, React, Yui (if it’s still used), and whatever other libraries we’re still using? This is what I mean about bolting things on. Then again, if React really does allow for cleaner interfaces, perhaps we’d find it taking over our interfaces rapidly, and it would become a de facto standard. I don’t know. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595 From: Kyle Hall [mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, 20 September 2016 3:31 PM To: David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au> Cc: Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org>; Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha. ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality. I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption. Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations? React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel- <mailto:koha-devel-> bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:bounces@lists.koha-community.org> ] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> > Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ <http://community.org/> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 6:29 PM, David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au> wrote:
I think it differs in that a search engine and a RESTful API adds core functionality. Without them, we can’t really search or expose services. We already have a JS UI toolkit, which seems to be working fine.
Yes, jQuery UI does work just fine, however libs like React really solve a different problem domain. In fact, it's expected that jQuery will be used within React for API access.
Why do you say that React is necessary and long overdue? In terms of your email, do you mean that it lets you do more with less code? I’m not necessarily opposed to that. I do get annoyed by having to write so much code to achieve small things at times.
That's the problem React solves! I takes *so* much less code to write an equivilent feature with React than it would with html and jQuery dom manipulation. I was actually a bit shocked at how fast I was able to rewrite the item messages feature in React.
I suppose I’m curious as to the motivation behind React at this point. Aren’t there higher priorities for Koha right now? I suppose maybe that’s just my own naïveté speaking, and part of the joy of having so many developers on Koha is that we can all focus on different aspects of the system.
That's the great thing about Koha as a community. Koha has no priorities, but each stakeholder can. I'm sure your priorities could be much different from my, but they can be pursued simultaneously!
Yet, shouldn’t there be some cohesion? Are our interfaces going to be a combination of plain JS, jQuery, Bootstrap, React, Yui (if it’s still used), and whatever other libraries we’re still using? This is what I mean about bolting things on.
Then again, if React really does allow for cleaner interfaces, perhaps we’d find it taking over our interfaces rapidly, and it would become a de facto standard. I don’t know.
There's only one way to find out ; ) In all seriousness, I just want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world. I want it to be an absolute pleasure to use. And I think this is a necessary milestone to achieving that goal. Kyle
David Cook
Systems Librarian
Prosentient Systems
72/330 Wattle St
Ultimo, NSW 2007
Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899
Direct: 02 8005 0595
*From:* Kyle Hall [mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com] *Sent:* Tuesday, 20 September 2016 3:31 PM *To:* David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au> *Cc:* Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org>; Koha Devel < koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>
*Subject:* Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha.
ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality.
I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption.
Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations?
React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files.
David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia
Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [mailto:koha-devel- bounces@lists.koha-community.org] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Hi there! I don't know how I intercepted this email since I never read my email, but... "In all seriousness, I just want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world. I want it to be an absolute pleasure to use. And I think this is a necessary milestone to achieving that goal." Kyle. I totally f***ing agree with you 10000%. Swagger2 + React + Redux will f*** the s*** out of any ILS Koha meets. Not to forget javascript BDD, PageObject and good test infrastructure to rapidly deploy test contexts and tear them down easily and efficiently. Regression is the worst PITA with Koha atm. I am looking forward to kopypaste the React + Redux framework the Oslo Public Library uses for their Library System Extended, but there are many great examples on how to put React + Redux to good use in Github. And most importantly many great examples on how to easily and effectively test all the components. I was planning to start a completely separate namespace (or project) 'KohaFi' for this so we can get rid of the legacy baggage and use only the REST API to move data from Koha to the newly branded KohaFi ;) (naturally reuse the good bits from old Koha to explain the obvious) We can leverage browser storage to speed up all kinds of system preferences and caching stuff. Rewriting one page/module at a time while still using the old Koha with url-redirects to fill up functionality not yet put under KohaFi. Taking a completely new approach to how i18n is done. Translation straight from the GUI. Rewriting most of the Koha internals effectively and putting everything under regression testing to maximize speed and verify API version immutability. Rewrite MARC::Record as a XS-module maybe? It would be good to separate the REST API with RabbitMQ from the core Koha so we can have sturdy transactions atleast there where those are needed (epayments). Start using HTTP2.0 or SPDY Use NodeJS and Ecmascript6/7 with Babelscript. +++ There are so many things modern web development practices would improve in Koha. Ofc before we (as in Finland) can start working on that I have a ton of stuff to do. Maybe next year we can hopefully work on this after we have migrated to ElasticSearch and the newest Koha-community version and gotten rid of the horrible Zebra and some self-service library automation project... Personally I see this as the only way for Koha to get rid of its legacy baggage, make it a good system and actually make working with it a pleasure. And if I have to take this route alone, I wont blink an eye for I know only success lies there. Looking forward to working with you. OAK ________________________________ From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org [koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org] on behalf of Kyle Hall [kyle.m.hall@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2016 5:27 PM To: David Cook Cc: Koha Devel Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 6:29 PM, David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au<mailto:dcook@prosentient.com.au>> wrote: I think it differs in that a search engine and a RESTful API adds core functionality. Without them, we can’t really search or expose services. We already have a JS UI toolkit, which seems to be working fine. Yes, jQuery UI does work just fine, however libs like React really solve a different problem domain. In fact, it's expected that jQuery will be used within React for API access. Why do you say that React is necessary and long overdue? In terms of your email, do you mean that it lets you do more with less code? I’m not necessarily opposed to that. I do get annoyed by having to write so much code to achieve small things at times. That's the problem React solves! I takes *so* much less code to write an equivilent feature with React than it would with html and jQuery dom manipulation. I was actually a bit shocked at how fast I was able to rewrite the item messages feature in React. I suppose I’m curious as to the motivation behind React at this point. Aren’t there higher priorities for Koha right now? I suppose maybe that’s just my own naïveté speaking, and part of the joy of having so many developers on Koha is that we can all focus on different aspects of the system. That's the great thing about Koha as a community. Koha has no priorities, but each stakeholder can. I'm sure your priorities could be much different from my, but they can be pursued simultaneously! Yet, shouldn’t there be some cohesion? Are our interfaces going to be a combination of plain JS, jQuery, Bootstrap, React, Yui (if it’s still used), and whatever other libraries we’re still using? This is what I mean about bolting things on. Then again, if React really does allow for cleaner interfaces, perhaps we’d find it taking over our interfaces rapidly, and it would become a de facto standard. I don’t know. There's only one way to find out ; ) In all seriousness, I just want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world. I want it to be an absolute pleasure to use. And I think this is a necessary milestone to achieving that goal. Kyle David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595 From: Kyle Hall [mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com<mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com>] Sent: Tuesday, 20 September 2016 3:31 PM To: David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au<mailto:dcook@prosentient.com.au>> Cc: Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org<mailto:oleonard@myacpl.org>>; Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha. ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality. I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption. Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations? React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel-<mailto:koha-devel-> bounces@lists.koha-community.org<mailto:bounces@lists.koha-community.org>] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org<mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org>> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org<mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/<http://community.org/> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Tomas: Fair enough about it being a POC so not showing how to translate it. I was just concerned that it would make translation more difficult, but it looks like that concern was baseless : ). Kyle: Well, I think I’m mostly persuaded. That said, I think it’s a shame that Koha has no priorities. I also want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world, but I think more collaboration and cooperation would help ensure that. I think that’s what folk were trying to do with that roadmap idea a while back. I don’t think <https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roadmap_for_Koha> https://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Roadmap_for_Koha has been updated in about 1.5 years though. I suppose it says it’s a memorandum of intent rather than a strategic plan. While I’m not saying that DSpace has it entirely right, they seem to be a lot more strategic in their planning. They introduced a REST API 3 years ago. They have (optional) SPARQL endpoints in their latest version. That said, DSpace is a less complex application, and it has a smaller core team which makes reaching consensus a lot easier. They still accept contributions outside the strategy. I had a pull request accepted a while ago, but it was a small commit which didn’t really interfere with their main work. I’m not that familiar with Evergreen, but, Galen, isn’t there an oversight board which discusses strategic issues? I suppose we don’t have to do X just because everyone else is doing X, but I wonder sometimes if Koha could use more direction. Take ElasticSearch for instance. We could’ve made a Koha 4, and replaced Zebra with ElasticSearch completely. It would’ve been a big effort, but certainly a worthwhile one. I suppose that would’ve run the risks of people continuing to provide patches for the 3.x branch while work continued on Koha 4… and thus created a divide. We could’ve said no more development on 3.x and targeted work on 4.x only, but that could have stifled innovation and turned people off Koha as well. Maybe it’s just a case of the grass being greener for me. I mean… I’m not a frequent contributor to Koha at the moment, so I could just be out of the loop as well. I think Jonathan and Katrin mentioned the developer meetings earlier. Perhaps that’s enough of a venue for strategic direction. I imagine the core contributors for Koha do tend to share a sense of direction? I think we’ve seen that with ElasticSearch, Plack, Bootstrap. Obviously some individuals and organisations spearhead those. I suppose being someone who contributes infrequently… I would like to work more with people because I can’t necessarily devote 100% of my time to improving one part of Koha. But if there were a particular goal where we could all pitch code in… I suppose at the moment the best way to do that is by testing patches and providing sign offs. But because there’s a lack of priorities… the patches awaiting sign off might be for things that won’t necessarily make Koha faster and slicker. I suppose it just goes back to us all wanting Koha to be the best. I just wonder if there are ways that we could improve how we do things to be more effective and efficient. For my part, I’d love to work on a better API for importing records. I fear though that I might not have enough clout in the community to actualize that though. Nor do I know exactly how to make that API better, since my use cases represent just a few of all use cases. I suppose that’s why people make RFCs yet I feel like many RFCs get mostly ignored. I suppose if Koha did have more direction, I would still be in the same or worse position if the community decided that improving the import API wasn’t a priority. I suppose at the moment the koha-devel listserv and the developer meetings are the venue to discuss these things, and if something catches the eye, they get discussed – like this React idea : ). David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595 From: Kyle Hall [mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, 22 September 2016 12:28 AM To: David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au> Cc: Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org>; Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 6:29 PM, David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook@prosentient.com.au> > wrote: I think it differs in that a search engine and a RESTful API adds core functionality. Without them, we can’t really search or expose services. We already have a JS UI toolkit, which seems to be working fine. Yes, jQuery UI does work just fine, however libs like React really solve a different problem domain. In fact, it's expected that jQuery will be used within React for API access. Why do you say that React is necessary and long overdue? In terms of your email, do you mean that it lets you do more with less code? I’m not necessarily opposed to that. I do get annoyed by having to write so much code to achieve small things at times. That's the problem React solves! I takes *so* much less code to write an equivilent feature with React than it would with html and jQuery dom manipulation. I was actually a bit shocked at how fast I was able to rewrite the item messages feature in React. I suppose I’m curious as to the motivation behind React at this point. Aren’t there higher priorities for Koha right now? I suppose maybe that’s just my own naïveté speaking, and part of the joy of having so many developers on Koha is that we can all focus on different aspects of the system. That's the great thing about Koha as a community. Koha has no priorities, but each stakeholder can. I'm sure your priorities could be much different from my, but they can be pursued simultaneously! Yet, shouldn’t there be some cohesion? Are our interfaces going to be a combination of plain JS, jQuery, Bootstrap, React, Yui (if it’s still used), and whatever other libraries we’re still using? This is what I mean about bolting things on. Then again, if React really does allow for cleaner interfaces, perhaps we’d find it taking over our interfaces rapidly, and it would become a de facto standard. I don’t know. There's only one way to find out ; ) In all seriousness, I just want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world. I want it to be an absolute pleasure to use. And I think this is a necessary milestone to achieving that goal. Kyle David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595 From: Kyle Hall [mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com <mailto:kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> ] Sent: Tuesday, 20 September 2016 3:31 PM To: David Cook <dcook@prosentient.com.au <mailto:dcook@prosentient.com.au> > Cc: Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org <mailto:oleonard@myacpl.org> >; Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> > Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React For my part, I don't know if we need to keep bolting on more new and shiny to Koha. ElasticSearch makes sense. A REST API makes sense. Fixing broken things or adding missing essential functionality. I'm not sure how this differs from Koha adding Zebra, adding Elastic or adding a restful api. To me, this is not a matter of adding new for the sake of new ( React isn't even new at this point ) but of adding something that is necessary and long overdue. The question isn't about needing React or not, it's about the need for a modern JS UI toolkit to take advantage of our svc and rest api's without the need to write crazy amounts of code to make it work with just jQuery. Take a look at the javascript file for the holds table and you'll see what I mean. A React implementation of it would be *so* much cleaner and easier to understand for everyone. Please don't ask me to rewrite it as a poc though ; ) I *will* be happy to rewrite it post-adoption. Also, how would this React POC go in terms of translations? React is just Javascript, and is translated the same way translate all our other js files. David Cook Systems Librarian Prosentient Systems 72/330 Wattle St Ultimo, NSW 2007 Australia Office: 02 9212 0899 Direct: 02 8005 0595
-----Original Message----- From: koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel-bounces@lists.koha-community.org> [mailto:koha-devel- <mailto:koha-devel-> bounces@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:bounces@lists.koha-community.org> ] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard Sent: Monday, 19 September 2016 11:33 PM To: Koha Devel <koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> > Subject: Re: [Koha-devel] To React or not to React
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org <mailto:Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org> http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha- community.org/ <http://community.org/> bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Sorry folks, but this is pretty long.
That said, I think it’s a shame that Koha has no priorities. I also want Koha to be the fastest, slickest most useful ILS in the world, but I think more collaboration and cooperation would help ensure that.
For companies to collaborate and cooperate requires time spent away from solving specific customer problems. My impression is that most Koha support companies don't feel they have the ability to spare that time. I do think this discussion is a good opportunity for some cooperation on deciding a possible new direction of front-end development. This conversation is getting way off track, so let's try to get back to the point. Is React something we want to add to the Koha staff client in a way that will lead to its being a new standard for the way we do JavaScript--in particular, as I understand it, DOM manipulation. I'm still very new to React, but it sounds like one of its main strengths is that is designed to be very fast when it comes to changing elements on the page. React could be used instead of jQuery for a lot of page manipulation operations but wouldn't necessarily replace jQuery altogether. React wouldn't replace the JavaScript widgets like menus and modals which Bootstrap supplies unless someone decided to rewrite those components in React, or to replace them with existing React-based versions of them. What are some questions which need to be answered before we can decide how to proceed? I propose: - How does using React affect translations? My impression from looking at React examples online (and from Bug 17297) is that React JS very often includes HTML markup in a way which would be too cumbersome to manage with the way we handle internationalization in JavaScript at this time. The volume of strings which would have to be defined in the templates would be unmanageable. - How does React affect the way we handle JavaScript dependencies now? React requires compilation. If we're going to add a compilation step for JavaScript assets, why not incorporate that into a process of building front-end assets that includes minification and concatenation of other JS and CSS assets. Is there something inherent to React which can improve the way we manage JS assets? If we say yes to React we are saying yes to Node.js as a developer dependency and yes to incorporating a build process into front-end development (which we have already done for the OPAC with LESS, but which was very controversial when I proposed using Grunt/Gulp). - Will we have enough of a consensus on React that it will be adopted by most if not all developers who want to be doing DOM manipulation with JavaScript? If we start using a tool which few developers want to or have the time to learn, the contributions to Koha which use React will be come unmaintainable if the React expert(s) leave. - What is the "global" picture, in the staff client, for how React will be used? What is the big picture, and will there be a commitment to getting that big picture implemented? Thanks for reading, Owen -- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries https://www.myacpl.org
On 22/09/2016 14:56, Owen Leonard wrote:
- How does using React affect translations?
My impression from looking at React examples online (and from Bug 17297) is that React JS very often includes HTML markup in a way which would be too cumbersome to manage with the way we handle internationalization in JavaScript at this time. The volume of strings which would have to be defined in the templates would be unmanageable.
I don't know React, but it looks like this particular problem can be solved by bug 15395. It allows (among other things) strings defined in .js files to be translatable. https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=15395 -- Julian Maurice <julian.maurice@biblibre.com> BibLibre
Owen, I didn't know that proposal had been shut down! I find it especially odd since we already require nodejs for converting our less files to css. We already have leaped the bar of needing to use nodejs as Koha developers, so I see no reason why cannot just use grunt or gulp via npm as we do the less complier. <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 9:32 AM, Owen Leonard <oleonard@myacpl.org> wrote:
Another thing is that you need nodejs to compile it so is another thing to throw on the stack.
Isn't this the kind of dependency requirement that killed my request to introduce a front-end build tool like Grunt or Gulp?
-- Owen
-- Web Developer Athens County Public Libraries http://www.myacpl.org _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 AM, Philippe Blouin < philippe.blouin@inlibro.com> wrote:
Can I not be against, yet still have concerns? :)
I'm glad you so gallantly dumped Angular, which I would have raised my hand Against since that thing obsolete past code every 6 months. But I do not know React. Could you sell me more the big plusses to do that. What will it replace, do you have an example? What about all the code waiting approval right now, will it become obsolete because non-Reactive ?
The big plus of React is that it really does allow quick development of very nice widgets that can be used and re-used. React is also a view layer only and does not throw everything and the kitchen sink in like Angular does. React does not obsolete any existing code, but it can be used to augment existing features and for new features wherever we want to use it!
All the big previous changes (bootstrap, dbix...) were not without pain, espeicially for those outside the core, not coding these technologies 24/7.
And how do you see React evolving in the next 5 years? Keeping up with bootstrap requires huge effort (if/when we upgrade).
React has a nice simple, stable api at this point. I cannot say what it will be in 5 years, but I can say that what is now will not limit us in the future. It does what we need it to do right now.
Again, I know little. Please don't ask me if I'm against, but give me your big sales pitch. :)
Of course! I have learned how to use React and Angular both just as for potential use in Koha. A direct comparison of them *for Koha* tells me that React is far better suited for our uses. Kyle
Cheers,
Philippe Blouin, Responsable du développement informatique
Tél. : (888) 604-2627 philippe.blouin@inLibro.com inLibro | pour esprit libre | www.inLibro.com On 09/19/2016 08:18 AM, Kyle Hall wrote:
Thanks for the feedback Stefano!
Please, if anybody is *against* the use of React in Koha, please voice your concerns!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( <http://www.meadvillelibrary.org> http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( <http://www.ccfls.org> http://www.ccfls.org )
On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:50 AM, Stefano Bargioni < <bargioni@pusc.it> bargioni@pusc.it> wrote:
My +1 for React. Angular requires a specific skill, other than Javascript. Stefano
On 15 set 2016, at 19:22, Kyle Hall < <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> kyle.m.hall@gmail.com> wrote:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: <https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297> https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( <http://bywatersolutions.com/> http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( <http://www.meadvillelibrary.org/> http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( <http://www.ccfls.org/> http://www.ccfls.org ) _______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing listKoha-devel@lists.koha-community.orghttp://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Hi Kyle; Thanks for this example. Would it be possible to see a working example to fully understand what you have in mind? Cheers, Jonathan 2016-09-15 19:22 GMT+02:00 Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com>:
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions, please let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
_______________________________________________ Koha-devel mailing list Koha-devel@lists.koha-community.org http://lists.koha-community.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/koha-devel website : http://www.koha-community.org/ git : http://git.koha-community.org/ bugs : http://bugs.koha-community.org/
Yes, I definitely want to complete the backend and make this a fully functioning submission before long. I decided to get it out as early as possible just to get this discussion rolling! <https://secure2.convio.net/cffh/site/Donation2?df_id=1395&FR_ID=4715&PROXY_ID=2706639&PROXY_TYPE=20&1395.donation=form1&s_src=CHORUS&s_subsrc=CHAADOEB> http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org ) On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:18 AM, Jonathan Druart < jonathan.druart@bugs.koha-community.org> wrote:
Hi Kyle;
Thanks for this example. Would it be possible to see a working example to fully understand what you have in mind?
Cheers, Jonathan
I have my proof of concept for using React within Koha completed! You can see it here: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id= 17297
Please give it a try!
So, I've written this development ( at least in part ) in both Angular and React. I know Angular 2 is out but here are my thoughts so far.
1) It's much easier to think in React than in Angular. React is for the most part just Javascript. It's far less opinionated than Angular. They saying goes React is Javascript and Angular is Angular. I think the flexibility of React works well within the Koha ecosystem.
2) Writing React feels much more like programming. I think it's much faster to develop reactive and ajax features in React than it is using jQuery.
3) React makes it pretty easy to create widgets that we can drop in to a given page and have just work. Pretty much anything that shows up on multiple pages would make for a good React widget. Think the holds table which is on the checkouts page and the patron details page. It is ajaxified now, but a far far cleaner version could be written in React.
4) React is just a view layer. Angular is a full MVC framework with many pieces we don't really need.
I think React is probably the way to go for Koha. I like Angular but for Koha in particular, I think React is a better fit. I think we really need to get this decision made as soon as possible. If anyone has opinions,
2016-09-15 19:22 GMT+02:00 Kyle Hall <kyle.m.hall@gmail.com>: please
let everyone know!
Kyle
http://www.kylehall.info ByWater Solutions ( http://bywatersolutions.com ) Meadville Public Library ( http://www.meadvillelibrary.org ) Crawford County Federated Library System ( http://www.ccfls.org )
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participants (12)
-
David Cook -
Jonathan Druart -
Julian Maurice -
Katrin -
Kivilahti Olli-Antti -
Kyle Hall -
Owen Leonard -
Philippe Blouin -
Rodrigo Santellan -
Stefano Bargioni -
SUZUKI Arthur -
Tomas Cohen Arazi