Hi all, I was just testing a small patch for 3.2 with a new preference not listed in the pref templates. Although the pref exists, you cannot find it or add it. (The manual does not yet explain how to add preferences too, or I could not find it.) I think it should be interesting to include (possibly older) local preferences that are not yet in the templates on a separate tab or so. The same holds for searching the prefs; the new version does not find preferences that are not listed in the pref files, but are in the database and can be used via C4::Context. This is somewhat confusing (to me)? Would it be better to allow finding them at least? Any thoughts? Regards, Marcel
Marcel, I have reported a lot of bugs about missing preferences. Most are found with this search: http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=sys+prefs As for instructions on how to add them, I can write that up, but the reason I haven't added some of these is because the implication is that they are not used in the code anymore or because I don't know how to add that particular preference. Thanks Nicole 2010/6/10 Marcel de Rooy <M.de.Rooy@rijksmuseum.nl>:
Hi all,
I was just testing a small patch for 3.2 with a new preference not listed in the pref templates. Although the pref exists, you cannot find it or add it. (The manual does not yet explain how to add preferences too, or I could not find it.)
I think it should be interesting to include (possibly older) local preferences that are not yet in the templates on a separate tab or so. The same holds for searching the prefs; the new version does not find preferences that are not listed in the pref files, but are in the database and can be used via C4::Context. This is somewhat confusing (to me)? Would it be better to allow finding them at least?
Any thoughts?
Regards,
Marcel
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Le 10/06/2010 14:10, Nicole Engard a écrit :
Marcel,
I have reported a lot of bugs about missing preferences. Most are found with this search: http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=sys+prefs
As for instructions on how to add them, I can write that up, but the reason I haven't added some of these is because the implication is that they are not used in the code anymore or because I don't know how to add that particular preference.
Thanks Nicole
Hi, about that new preferences editor, I really can appreciate the work Jesse Weaver did. I like the javascript and the hierarchy and the search and the way to update the whole page at once... Really. But it appears that to us, it is more messy than the previous system : - requires the edition of many files (sql and pref) rather than centralizing things. - the translation of the yaml file will be clumsy (think of arabic ppl who donot have the same way to tell Do don't) - And the Boolean approach in that system is quite inadapted to PERL : No and Yes for 0 and 1... Problem is that PERL interprets No as 1... unfortunately. We are therefore compelled not to use that system.... Anyone here having the same problems ? -- Henri-Damien LAURENT
about that new preferences editor, I really can appreciate the work Jesse Weaver did. I like the javascript and the hierarchy and the search and the way to update the whole page at once... Really.
I agree. The idea is good. The implementation is arguable.
- requires the edition of many files (sql and pref) rather than centralizing things.
The procedure for adding a new syspref has changed : * Before: o add an entry in systempreferences.pl file to distribute the syspref to an editor tab (no so good!) o add a revision to updatedatabase.pl to append the new syspref to an installed Koha o add an entry into kohastructure.sql * Now, with the new editor: o add a revision to updatedatabase.pl to append the new syspref to an installed Koha o add a entry into kohastructure.sql o add the syspref in a YAML file I'd had preferred system preferences to be outsided from the DB and put into a single config file.
- the translation of the yaml file will be clumsy (think of arabic ppl who donot have the same way to tell Do don't)
+1 -- It's stil an issue with French. I can't imagine what non-latin languages translator will have to cope with. The syntax is different and so the way a syspref can be embedded into a sentence. With the current syspref editor, a preference (and 2 sometime) is expressed in a sentence which is cut in several parts. The syspref is inserted somewhere in the sentence, roughly at the beginning, the middle or the end. This position which make sense in English has to be preserved by the translator. Very often it will oblige the translator to construct sentences which are syntactically ill-formed in his language.
We are therefore compelled not to use that system....
What does it mean? -- Frédéric DEMIANS
Le 17/06/2010 07:39, Frederic Demians a écrit :
We are therefore compelled not to use that system....
What does it mean?
As it stands now, and since some customers are going live soon or already have. We replaced all the occurences of preferences.pl in admin-home and main page with systempreferences.pl since that script was still to be used in order to add new preferences and was still usable even though not very user-friendly. -- Henri-Damien LAURENT
On 17 June 2010 17:39, Frederic Demians <frederic@tamil.fr> wrote:
about that new preferences editor, I really can appreciate the work Jesse Weaver did. I like the javascript and the hierarchy and the search and the way to update the whole page at once... Really.
I agree. The idea is good. The implementation is arguable.
- requires the edition of many files (sql and pref) rather than centralizing things.
The procedure for adding a new syspref has changed :
* Before: o add an entry in systempreferences.pl file to distribute the syspref to an editor tab (no so good!) o add a revision to updatedatabase.pl to append the new syspref to an installed Koha o add an entry into kohastructure.sql * Now, with the new editor: o add a revision to updatedatabase.pl to append the new syspref to an installed Koha o add a entry into kohastructure.sql o add the syspref in a YAML file
I'd had preferred system preferences to be outsided from the DB and put into a single config file.
- the translation of the yaml file will be clumsy (think of arabic ppl who donot have the same way to tell Do don't)
+1 -- It's stil an issue with French. I can't imagine what non-latin languages translator will have to cope with. The syntax is different and so the way a syspref can be embedded into a sentence. With the current syspref editor, a preference (and 2 sometime) is expressed in a sentence which is cut in several parts. The syspref is inserted somewhere in the sentence, roughly at the beginning, the middle or the end. This position which make sense in English has to be preserved by the translator. Very often it will oblige the translator to construct sentences which are syntactically ill-formed in his language.
We mustn't forget that before we couldn't translate the systempreferences at all, or we could only do it into one language you certainly couldn't have it translated in more than one, from that respect its a huge improvement. So before we dump on it too much, lets remember that. Lets also remember that Jesse did it, while others talked about it, someone went and wrote some code, lets do more of that and less of denigrating others work. Chris
We mustn't forget that before we couldn't translate the systempreferences at all, or we could only do it into one language you certainly couldn't have it translated in more than one, from that respect its a huge improvement.
You get a point. Before, sysprefs were translatable but only by updating .sql files. Now, and I agree it's a huge improvement, translation can be delegated to translator rather than to developers. My concern about difficulties for translators to get syntactic well-formed sentences can have a solution if syspref description are well chosen and avoid English idiotisms. We must get feedback from translators about issues they encounter and then define rules for syspref descriptions.
So before we dump on it too much, lets remember that. Lets also remember that Jesse did it, while others talked about it, someone went and wrote some code, lets do more of that and less of denigrating others work.
It wasn't my intent and so I apologize if it was perceived this way. I add a page in the wiki to go ahead in the right direction for developers and translators: http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/System_Preferences Native English speakers are invited to fix my misspelling and gallicisms. -- Frédéric DEMIANS
On 17 June 2010 22:27, Frederic Demians <frederic@tamil.fr> wrote:
We mustn't forget that before we couldn't translate the systempreferences at all, or we could only do it into one language you certainly couldn't have it translated in more than one, from that respect its a huge improvement.
You get a point. Before, sysprefs were translatable but only by updating .sql files. Now, and I agree it's a huge improvement, translation can be delegated to translator rather than to developers. My concern about difficulties for translators to get syntactic well-formed sentences can have a solution if syspref description are well chosen and avoid English idiotisms. We must get feedback from translators about issues they encounter and then define rules for syspref descriptions.
I think that's a great idea.
So before we dump on it too much, lets remember that. Lets also remember that Jesse did it, while others talked about it, someone went and wrote some code, lets do more of that and less of denigrating others work.
It wasn't my intent and so I apologize if it was perceived this way.
It was probably an overreaction on my part and I apologise also.
I add a page in the wiki to go ahead in the right direction for developers and translators:
http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/System_Preferences
Native English speakers are invited to fix my misspelling and gallicisms.
Fabulous, looking now. Chris
Frederic Demians wrote:
well chosen and avoid English idiotisms. [SNIP] Native English speakers are invited to fix my misspelling and gallicisms.
I had to smile with your use of the above malapropism above. Many English idioms, and French idioms for that matter, are indeed idiotisms :) cheers rick -- _________________________________ Rick Welykochy || Praxis Services "Most folk are about as happy as they make up their minds to be." -- anon
participants (6)
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Chris Cormack -
Frederic Demians -
LAURENT Henri-Damien -
Marcel de Rooy -
Nicole Engard -
Rick Welykochy